78: Holistic Burnout Recovery: Spiritual Tools for Mental Wellness

Episode 78: Holistic Burnout Recovery with Allie Kochert - Mind Body Detox Podcast

 In Episode 78 of the Mind Body Detox Podcast, host Kara Lovehart, a Mind-Body Psychic Medium and Executive Intuitive Business Coach , sits down with Allie Kochert, a licensed therapist, spiritual director, and resiliency coach, to discuss the growing problem of burnout and Allie’s personalized approach to burnout recovery. Learn how Allie uses at-home burnout intensives that combine psychotherapy, spiritual direction, and holistic methods to help clients heal naturally.

Key Episode Highlights:

💜 Holistic Burnout Recovery – Discover how Allie Kochert’s unique at-home burnout intensives offer clients a way to recover in their own space with intensive support.
💜 Mind-Body-Spirit Approach – Learn how Allie integrates psychotherapy and spiritual direction for a complete mind-body healing experience.
💜 Astrology & Tarot – Explore how Allie uses astrology and tarot, when appropriate, to guide clients through their healing journey.
💜 Jungian Dream Interpretation – Understand the power of dreams and how interpreting them through a Jungian lens can lead to deeper emotional healing.
💜 Actionable Healing Tips – Get practical advice on how to recover from burnout using holistic practices that support mental, physical, and emotional wellness.

In this episode, Kara and Allie explore the mind-body-spirit connection in burnout recovery. Allie explains how her burnout intensives offer a holistic, personalized approach, incorporating tools like astrology, Jungian dream interpretation, and tarot. This discussion provides listeners with insights into how holistic methods can transform mental exhaustion into long-term healing and resiliency.

About Allie Kochert:

Allie Kochert, MA, LPC, CSD, is a licensed psychotherapist, certified spiritual director, and resiliency coach. She specializes in trauma-conscious care and helps individuals reclaim their resiliency, authenticity, and life purpose. Allie serves clients at her spiritual direction practice, Root Grow Thrive, offering mind-body-soul care and dreamwork for women in caregiving and ministry professions. She also runs Rooted Growth Counseling, where she supports helpers and healers in Pennsylvania and beyond.

👉 Visit Allie’s websites for more information:

• Root Grow Thrive
• Allie Kochert

Additional Resources:

• Open Path Psychotherapy Collective
• Crisis Hotlines & Resources
• Reclamation Collective
• Find Your Local NAMI Chapter

Take Action:

• Burned Out? Take Allie’s burnout quiz here.
• Are You a Therapist or Mental Health Practitioner? Join Allie’s Creative Resiliency Circle for healing through poetry, mindfulness, and burnout care.

Transcript

Podcast Episode Summary: Exploring Burnout Recovery on the Mind Body Detox Podcast with Kara Lovehart

In this episode of the Mind Body Detox Podcast, hosted by Kara Lovehart, a Mind-Body Psychic Medium and Executive Intuitive Business Coach, we dive deep into integrative and holistic approaches to burnout recovery. Kara is joined by Allie Kochert, an integrative therapist and psycho-spiritual consultant, to discuss trauma-informed care and the growing issue of burnout, especially among caregivers, therapists, and healthcare professionals.

The conversation focuses on the relationship between trauma and burnout, how unresolved trauma often overlaps with burnout, and the importance of addressing vicarious trauma experienced by caregivers. Allie emphasizes the need for trauma-informed practices in therapy and care, which help individuals feel safe and supported as they navigate their healing journeys.

One of the highlights is Allie's introduction of therapeutic retreat intensives, a condensed and accelerated model of care designed to provide deep healing in a shorter time frame. These intensives offer a unique blend of therapy, creative practices, and soul-care, helping clients reconnect with their core purpose and navigate the emotional and physical toll of burnout.

Kara shares her own experiences with burnout as an empath and highly sensitive person, offering insights into how reconnecting with her emotional self through practices like dream work, kundalini yoga, and creative therapies helped her regain resilience. Throughout the episode, the conversation touches on the importance of community, connection, and building safe spaces for healing, offering listeners practical tools and a new perspective on managing stress and burnout.

Tune in to this episode of the Mind Body Detox Podcast to gain a deeper understanding of holistic approaches to burnout recovery and how to cultivate resilience in mind, body, and spirit.

 
00:00:02.563 --> 00:00:06.165
This is the MindBodyDetox podcast,
 
00:00:06.544 --> 00:00:08.465
where we discuss all things
 
00:00:08.666 --> 00:00:10.426
integrative health and wellness,
 
00:00:10.907 --> 00:00:12.208
interviewing folks from all
 
00:00:12.268 --> 00:00:12.968
over the world,
 
00:00:13.169 --> 00:00:15.150
sharing insights and wisdom
 
00:00:15.369 --> 00:00:18.172
for how to live a healthier life in mind,
 
00:00:18.411 --> 00:00:19.911
body, and spirit.
 
00:00:22.946 --> 00:00:24.167
welcome back everyone to the
 
00:00:24.207 --> 00:00:25.788
mind body detox podcast
 
00:00:25.948 --> 00:00:27.228
I'm your host mind body
 
00:00:27.248 --> 00:00:28.789
medium karen lovehart and
 
00:00:28.809 --> 00:00:30.268
today we have miss ali
 
00:00:30.309 --> 00:00:32.030
cochert back with us again
 
00:00:32.130 --> 00:00:33.250
so if you have not listened
 
00:00:33.270 --> 00:00:34.549
to the past episodes we
 
00:00:34.570 --> 00:00:36.271
will reference them ali
 
00:00:36.290 --> 00:00:37.831
cochert is an integrative
 
00:00:37.871 --> 00:00:39.572
therapist a spiritual
 
00:00:39.612 --> 00:00:40.692
director and a
 
00:00:40.752 --> 00:00:42.192
psycho-spiritual consultant
 
00:00:42.253 --> 00:00:43.593
so the last episodes we did
 
00:00:43.612 --> 00:00:45.194
with her were working with
 
00:00:45.234 --> 00:00:46.793
healing trauma and burnout
 
00:00:47.154 --> 00:00:47.914
and then we were talking
 
00:00:47.933 --> 00:00:49.475
about spiritually safe spaces
 
00:00:49.854 --> 00:00:51.896
So we talked about those and
 
00:00:52.276 --> 00:00:53.335
this particular episode,
 
00:00:53.356 --> 00:00:54.036
we're going to be going
 
00:00:54.076 --> 00:00:56.576
into the topic of burnout.
 
00:00:56.957 --> 00:00:58.398
So integrative approaches
 
00:00:58.438 --> 00:00:59.838
specifically and holistic
 
00:00:59.857 --> 00:01:01.639
approaches to burnout recovery.
 
00:01:01.918 --> 00:01:02.959
So let's bring Miss Allie
 
00:01:02.978 --> 00:01:04.200
back on the show.
 
00:01:06.344 --> 00:01:09.365
Hey Kara, nice to see you again.
 
00:01:10.365 --> 00:01:11.126
Hi everyone.
 
00:01:11.727 --> 00:01:15.128
So you've been busy since we
 
00:01:15.188 --> 00:01:16.248
last connected.
 
00:01:16.968 --> 00:01:18.308
You created some really cool
 
00:01:18.368 --> 00:01:20.728
retreats and some offerings you're doing.
 
00:01:21.129 --> 00:01:22.170
So I know we're gonna talk
 
00:01:22.189 --> 00:01:23.569
about those today,
 
00:01:23.989 --> 00:01:25.950
but I guess before we dive into that,
 
00:01:26.590 --> 00:01:27.551
if anyone has not listened
 
00:01:27.590 --> 00:01:29.512
to our past episodes we've done together,
 
00:01:30.391 --> 00:01:30.871
it would be really
 
00:01:30.912 --> 00:01:32.013
beautiful if we could share
 
00:01:33.013 --> 00:01:34.653
what you do as far as
 
00:01:34.834 --> 00:01:37.593
working with trauma-informed services.
 
00:01:37.754 --> 00:01:38.635
You're trauma-informed in
 
00:01:38.655 --> 00:01:39.954
your care and your practices.
 
00:01:39.995 --> 00:01:41.635
You're an educator in that way.
 
00:01:42.415 --> 00:01:44.355
And there's a lot of chronic
 
00:01:44.396 --> 00:01:45.856
stress and burnout in our culture.
 
00:01:45.936 --> 00:01:47.236
So it would be really great
 
00:01:47.257 --> 00:01:48.356
for us to define that and
 
00:01:48.397 --> 00:01:49.737
what that actually is.
 
00:01:49.817 --> 00:01:51.317
Sure, yeah.
 
00:01:51.358 --> 00:01:51.518
Well,
 
00:01:51.558 --> 00:01:53.899
trauma-informed care is sort of the
 
00:01:53.938 --> 00:01:56.379
crux of therapy and the therapy world.
 
00:01:57.180 --> 00:01:59.599
Many of us have heard that term,
 
00:01:59.680 --> 00:02:01.100
even if you're not in therapy.
 
00:02:01.760 --> 00:02:03.341
just being thrown around.
 
00:02:04.623 --> 00:02:05.323
But, you know,
 
00:02:05.444 --> 00:02:06.284
I think being trauma
 
00:02:06.344 --> 00:02:08.507
informed is essential in
 
00:02:09.326 --> 00:02:10.649
any caregiving profession.
 
00:02:10.788 --> 00:02:13.670
So as an integrative therapist,
 
00:02:13.751 --> 00:02:15.292
I'm trained in trauma care.
 
00:02:16.032 --> 00:02:18.194
I utilize holistic practices,
 
00:02:18.235 --> 00:02:19.475
but as well as like
 
00:02:20.556 --> 00:02:21.918
internal family systems and
 
00:02:21.957 --> 00:02:24.319
somatic experiencing and
 
00:02:25.260 --> 00:02:26.442
lots of different trainings
 
00:02:26.461 --> 00:02:28.843
that come in to help me
 
00:02:29.343 --> 00:02:31.245
with orient myself to a
 
00:02:31.305 --> 00:02:33.185
healing embodied experience
 
00:02:33.205 --> 00:02:34.205
with with clients.
 
00:02:34.265 --> 00:02:35.945
But in general, you know,
 
00:02:35.985 --> 00:02:39.366
trauma is is is ubiquitous.
 
00:02:39.467 --> 00:02:40.147
It's everywhere.
 
00:02:40.187 --> 00:02:42.329
We've all experienced it on some level,
 
00:02:42.368 --> 00:02:44.568
big T and small T. There's
 
00:02:44.688 --> 00:02:45.469
lots of different
 
00:02:45.509 --> 00:02:47.349
definitions of what trauma is.
 
00:02:47.830 --> 00:02:49.610
We go into that a lot in
 
00:02:49.651 --> 00:02:51.032
those previous podcasts.
 
00:02:51.092 --> 00:02:53.051
But but in general,
 
00:02:53.132 --> 00:02:54.473
it's it's it's an
 
00:02:54.532 --> 00:02:57.753
experience that gets us to a place of
 
00:02:58.935 --> 00:03:00.937
A felt sense of a lack of
 
00:03:00.997 --> 00:03:03.019
safety and security where
 
00:03:03.439 --> 00:03:05.902
we have a risk to bodily harm,
 
00:03:06.043 --> 00:03:09.526
psychological harm, emotional harm.
 
00:03:10.127 --> 00:03:12.890
So those can be collective
 
00:03:13.050 --> 00:03:14.292
trauma that can be
 
00:03:14.953 --> 00:03:17.656
experienced in a collective, in a group.
 
00:03:18.103 --> 00:03:19.782
It can experience one-on-one.
 
00:03:19.823 --> 00:03:21.383
It can be a one-time thing.
 
00:03:21.424 --> 00:03:23.584
It can be over time, over childhood,
 
00:03:23.663 --> 00:03:24.324
for instance.
 
00:03:25.324 --> 00:03:27.485
When it comes to complex trauma,
 
00:03:27.525 --> 00:03:30.406
it tends to be childhood trauma.
 
00:03:30.445 --> 00:03:32.765
So trauma is one of those
 
00:03:32.786 --> 00:03:35.306
things that needs to be
 
00:03:35.347 --> 00:03:38.347
assessed with a caregiver,
 
00:03:38.806 --> 00:03:40.867
as well as something that
 
00:03:40.907 --> 00:03:41.987
you claim as your own,
 
00:03:42.367 --> 00:03:44.628
that we get to have the
 
00:03:44.709 --> 00:03:46.528
agency to say whether or not we feel
 
00:03:47.044 --> 00:03:48.265
Like our harm, our,
 
00:03:48.346 --> 00:03:49.326
our boundaries have been
 
00:03:49.447 --> 00:03:52.289
violated and we've been, um,
 
00:03:52.310 --> 00:03:53.091
we we've been harmed.
 
00:03:53.170 --> 00:03:56.234
So, um, and then burnout, you know,
 
00:03:56.334 --> 00:03:59.216
is almost like a Venn diagram in that,
 
00:03:59.256 --> 00:04:00.497
like a lot of there's an
 
00:04:00.598 --> 00:04:01.979
overlap between trauma.
 
00:04:02.707 --> 00:04:03.407
and burnout.
 
00:04:03.467 --> 00:04:04.747
Not everyone with burnout
 
00:04:04.828 --> 00:04:06.649
has had trauma in the way
 
00:04:06.688 --> 00:04:08.508
that maybe they would describe,
 
00:04:08.549 --> 00:04:09.889
but a lot of people do.
 
00:04:10.509 --> 00:04:12.129
And a type of trauma that
 
00:04:12.150 --> 00:04:13.210
has often come up in
 
00:04:13.270 --> 00:04:15.129
burnout is vicarious trauma.
 
00:04:17.670 --> 00:04:19.350
Secondary trauma is another term.
 
00:04:19.471 --> 00:04:21.791
So it's the idea that when
 
00:04:21.812 --> 00:04:23.271
we work with people who
 
00:04:23.291 --> 00:04:26.112
have been through very difficult or
 
00:04:28.153 --> 00:04:29.935
uh painful experiences
 
00:04:29.975 --> 00:04:33.980
traumatic loss um really uh
 
00:04:34.822 --> 00:04:36.944
major grief processes if we
 
00:04:37.004 --> 00:04:38.286
work with people who have
 
00:04:38.326 --> 00:04:39.728
been harmed and we hear
 
00:04:39.767 --> 00:04:43.512
those stories then we can carry um
 
00:04:44.432 --> 00:04:47.894
the traumatic experience with us,
 
00:04:48.295 --> 00:04:49.415
especially those of us who
 
00:04:49.435 --> 00:04:51.136
are sensitives and empaths
 
00:04:51.175 --> 00:04:52.877
and caregivers that we can
 
00:04:52.916 --> 00:04:54.117
carry the trauma.
 
00:04:55.458 --> 00:04:57.197
And so that's a protective response.
 
00:04:57.278 --> 00:04:59.098
It's something that we as humans,
 
00:04:59.139 --> 00:05:00.180
because we live
 
00:05:00.279 --> 00:05:02.821
interdependently and interconnectively,
 
00:05:03.081 --> 00:05:04.000
that's a protective
 
00:05:04.040 --> 00:05:07.221
response that we share the
 
00:05:07.242 --> 00:05:08.062
burden together.
 
00:05:08.142 --> 00:05:08.543
But
 
00:05:09.382 --> 00:05:10.725
We have to realize that that
 
00:05:10.745 --> 00:05:12.108
can actually be harmful if
 
00:05:12.149 --> 00:05:14.254
we don't know how to
 
00:05:14.334 --> 00:05:16.399
process the trauma or we
 
00:05:16.418 --> 00:05:17.461
don't have help doing so.
 
00:05:18.564 --> 00:05:18.684
Yeah,
 
00:05:18.704 --> 00:05:20.324
I think I'm wondering if you've had
 
00:05:20.425 --> 00:05:21.285
experienced trauma,
 
00:05:21.305 --> 00:05:22.665
which causes a lot of just
 
00:05:23.105 --> 00:05:24.065
already wear and tear on
 
00:05:24.086 --> 00:05:24.906
the nervous system.
 
00:05:25.487 --> 00:05:26.687
If burnout is something
 
00:05:26.706 --> 00:05:27.966
that's more likely or
 
00:05:28.208 --> 00:05:31.528
easier experienced from the
 
00:05:32.108 --> 00:05:32.908
perspective of someone's
 
00:05:32.949 --> 00:05:34.009
nervous system is already
 
00:05:34.089 --> 00:05:35.269
challenged with trying to
 
00:05:35.310 --> 00:05:36.250
find regulation.
 
00:05:36.771 --> 00:05:38.870
Do you have any understanding of that?
 
00:05:38.911 --> 00:05:40.411
Or is that connector connection there?
 
00:05:41.954 --> 00:05:42.673
Well, absolutely.
 
00:05:42.713 --> 00:05:42.954
I mean,
 
00:05:43.074 --> 00:05:45.035
one of the terms like you hear in
 
00:05:45.055 --> 00:05:45.396
this sort of
 
00:05:45.435 --> 00:05:46.935
trauma-informed world is zone
 
00:05:46.975 --> 00:05:47.697
of tolerance.
 
00:05:47.716 --> 00:05:48.757
So if you're outside of that
 
00:05:48.817 --> 00:05:49.718
zone of tolerance,
 
00:05:49.757 --> 00:05:51.077
if your nervous system is
 
00:05:51.197 --> 00:05:54.500
outside a window of the ability to cope,
 
00:05:55.620 --> 00:05:56.841
therefore you'll be much
 
00:05:56.880 --> 00:05:59.242
more activated outside of that window.
 
00:05:59.362 --> 00:06:00.422
So if you're living your
 
00:06:00.543 --> 00:06:03.223
life with a very narrow
 
00:06:03.264 --> 00:06:04.163
window of tolerance,
 
00:06:04.204 --> 00:06:06.665
you're much more easily, quote unquote,
 
00:06:06.745 --> 00:06:07.365
triggered,
 
00:06:07.745 --> 00:06:10.166
the old school word for activated.
 
00:06:10.579 --> 00:06:12.862
And therefore, if you're highly activated,
 
00:06:13.163 --> 00:06:14.764
you have much higher risk
 
00:06:14.865 --> 00:06:17.387
of chronic stress and, um,
 
00:06:17.548 --> 00:06:18.728
major stress on the nervous
 
00:06:18.749 --> 00:06:21.312
system and actually more, more, um,
 
00:06:22.252 --> 00:06:23.634
potentially a higher,
 
00:06:23.975 --> 00:06:25.196
higher incidence of trauma.
 
00:06:25.750 --> 00:06:26.750
or I'm feeling traumatized.
 
00:06:26.872 --> 00:06:27.711
Yeah.
 
00:06:27.732 --> 00:06:28.851
I wanted to share briefly,
 
00:06:29.192 --> 00:06:29.992
one of the things that I
 
00:06:30.033 --> 00:06:31.132
find really interesting
 
00:06:31.213 --> 00:06:34.035
about this whole topic is I
 
00:06:34.074 --> 00:06:35.454
have an innate drive to
 
00:06:35.776 --> 00:06:37.355
continue to really expand
 
00:06:37.375 --> 00:06:38.497
my consciousness and help
 
00:06:38.536 --> 00:06:39.516
others along the way.
 
00:06:40.197 --> 00:06:41.497
And because of that drive,
 
00:06:42.158 --> 00:06:44.579
I have recognized through my own journey,
 
00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:47.300
through not only business trauma,
 
00:06:47.480 --> 00:06:48.680
that's a type of trauma,
 
00:06:48.920 --> 00:06:50.221
but then burnout along the way,
 
00:06:50.262 --> 00:06:51.903
but also being neurodivergent
 
00:06:52.583 --> 00:06:53.404
like I have like the
 
00:06:53.444 --> 00:06:55.511
trifecta of all the things
 
00:06:55.550 --> 00:06:57.375
that my nervous system had
 
00:06:57.495 --> 00:06:58.458
a potential for
 
00:06:59.750 --> 00:07:00.531
going through it,
 
00:07:00.571 --> 00:07:01.451
but then now having this
 
00:07:01.490 --> 00:07:02.651
resiliency that I can
 
00:07:02.752 --> 00:07:04.012
cultivate with myself.
 
00:07:04.452 --> 00:07:05.733
So on one hand,
 
00:07:05.793 --> 00:07:06.653
it was like a really
 
00:07:06.694 --> 00:07:07.415
challenging learning
 
00:07:07.454 --> 00:07:08.954
experience and it always is
 
00:07:08.995 --> 00:07:11.177
still continuing to learn and grow.
 
00:07:11.617 --> 00:07:13.177
But I feel very grateful for
 
00:07:13.237 --> 00:07:14.278
you as a resource and all
 
00:07:14.298 --> 00:07:15.639
the things I continue to learn.
 
00:07:16.920 --> 00:07:18.540
I must feel like if I can go
 
00:07:18.581 --> 00:07:19.682
through that with the
 
00:07:19.721 --> 00:07:20.622
nervous system that I have
 
00:07:20.661 --> 00:07:21.523
as this highly sensitive
 
00:07:21.583 --> 00:07:22.824
person and as a medium,
 
00:07:22.884 --> 00:07:25.084
I'm more sensitive to extra stimuli.
 
00:07:25.564 --> 00:07:26.846
Having that ability,
 
00:07:26.906 --> 00:07:28.307
I feel so grateful because
 
00:07:29.288 --> 00:07:29.987
I don't really know what
 
00:07:30.007 --> 00:07:30.728
other people have gone
 
00:07:30.747 --> 00:07:32.490
through and how challenging it can be.
 
00:07:32.790 --> 00:07:34.290
And even if you are
 
00:07:34.331 --> 00:07:35.471
neurodivergent or on the
 
00:07:35.490 --> 00:07:36.951
spectrum or have already these,
 
00:07:37.132 --> 00:07:38.572
you're outside the window of tolerance,
 
00:07:38.612 --> 00:07:38.773
right?
 
00:07:38.793 --> 00:07:39.994
You're more sensitive.
 
00:07:40.274 --> 00:07:41.295
It's even more challenging.
 
00:07:42.014 --> 00:07:42.555
But I have so much
 
00:07:42.615 --> 00:07:44.617
compassion for that process
 
00:07:44.637 --> 00:07:45.637
because I've gone through it.
 
00:07:45.958 --> 00:07:47.199
And so even more...
 
00:07:47.759 --> 00:07:49.720
passion for what you're doing,
 
00:07:49.759 --> 00:07:51.000
for what you're offering.
 
00:07:51.141 --> 00:07:52.302
And of course,
 
00:07:52.341 --> 00:07:53.442
we just did another podcast
 
00:07:53.762 --> 00:07:55.963
for burnout retreats and care.
 
00:07:56.303 --> 00:07:57.925
So I'd love to hear a little
 
00:07:57.964 --> 00:08:00.547
bit more about the term for burnout,
 
00:08:00.607 --> 00:08:02.788
like why it's common today
 
00:08:03.408 --> 00:08:06.771
and what you're offering right now.
 
00:08:07.011 --> 00:08:08.170
You're really moving into
 
00:08:08.211 --> 00:08:10.052
this space for the soul
 
00:08:10.093 --> 00:08:10.973
care and as far as a
 
00:08:11.012 --> 00:08:12.394
retreat type of package.
 
00:08:12.814 --> 00:08:13.975
So yeah, tell us about that.
 
00:08:15.646 --> 00:08:16.386
Yeah, why?
 
00:08:16.406 --> 00:08:17.166
Well, you know,
 
00:08:17.247 --> 00:08:18.968
I think burnout's always been around.
 
00:08:19.028 --> 00:08:19.788
I think we just don't,
 
00:08:20.009 --> 00:08:21.350
we haven't had a term for
 
00:08:21.370 --> 00:08:24.310
it in a way that resonates with folks.
 
00:08:25.552 --> 00:08:28.293
And also there's just an
 
00:08:28.434 --> 00:08:29.975
increased awareness of
 
00:08:30.035 --> 00:08:33.817
systemic and collective distress.
 
00:08:33.977 --> 00:08:37.279
I think especially it may be
 
00:08:37.340 --> 00:08:38.701
because I'm not really sure,
 
00:08:38.740 --> 00:08:40.000
but because of social media
 
00:08:40.061 --> 00:08:41.081
and the interconnective
 
00:08:41.121 --> 00:08:42.403
nature of people talking
 
00:08:42.423 --> 00:08:43.923
about their lives in a different way.
 
00:08:44.717 --> 00:08:46.759
Then back in the day,
 
00:08:47.419 --> 00:08:48.701
there's so many reasons why
 
00:08:48.740 --> 00:08:50.162
burnout is more ubiquitous
 
00:08:50.241 --> 00:08:52.183
now than it was even ten to fifteen,
 
00:08:52.264 --> 00:08:54.044
twenty, thirty years ago.
 
00:08:54.706 --> 00:08:57.027
And I share the story in the
 
00:08:57.067 --> 00:08:58.227
previous podcast.
 
00:08:58.327 --> 00:08:59.528
I come from a family of
 
00:08:59.568 --> 00:09:02.510
healers and helpers generationally,
 
00:09:03.131 --> 00:09:05.453
and burnout has always been there.
 
00:09:07.034 --> 00:09:09.897
It just hasn't been in a way that is
 
00:09:12.500 --> 00:09:15.981
is we orient ourselves in a
 
00:09:16.062 --> 00:09:18.482
way that we do in a modern sense.
 
00:09:19.582 --> 00:09:21.083
The problem with the way
 
00:09:21.104 --> 00:09:22.445
burnout's talked about
 
00:09:23.625 --> 00:09:25.885
these days is that it's an
 
00:09:25.966 --> 00:09:28.327
individual problem that we
 
00:09:28.368 --> 00:09:30.928
have to recover from and deal with.
 
00:09:31.933 --> 00:09:34.075
Whereas in my experience in
 
00:09:34.095 --> 00:09:35.615
working as a burnout therapist,
 
00:09:35.655 --> 00:09:38.017
this is a systemic problem.
 
00:09:38.076 --> 00:09:39.618
Burnout's a systemic problem
 
00:09:40.337 --> 00:09:44.259
that we fall underneath.
 
00:09:45.321 --> 00:09:46.880
It doesn't mean that we
 
00:09:48.442 --> 00:09:49.802
can't do anything over the
 
00:09:49.842 --> 00:09:51.504
fact that we have broken
 
00:09:51.543 --> 00:09:52.884
healthcare systems or
 
00:09:52.903 --> 00:09:54.684
broken educational systems.
 
00:09:55.306 --> 00:09:58.767
I work with mostly healers, helpers,
 
00:09:58.807 --> 00:10:00.008
and teachers, educators.
 
00:10:00.697 --> 00:10:03.158
You know,
 
00:10:03.437 --> 00:10:06.339
we can't prevent the way the
 
00:10:06.399 --> 00:10:08.460
structures are broken.
 
00:10:09.100 --> 00:10:11.421
We can cope with the
 
00:10:11.461 --> 00:10:13.302
situation perhaps maybe
 
00:10:13.361 --> 00:10:14.841
even a little differently,
 
00:10:15.302 --> 00:10:17.624
as well as advocating for change,
 
00:10:18.183 --> 00:10:20.705
which is that second part I think is,
 
00:10:21.669 --> 00:10:23.370
is absolutely essential and
 
00:10:23.390 --> 00:10:24.312
should be core.
 
00:10:24.892 --> 00:10:26.113
If you are burned out and
 
00:10:26.133 --> 00:10:27.394
you are seeking treatment,
 
00:10:27.413 --> 00:10:28.735
it should be core to your
 
00:10:28.774 --> 00:10:30.515
treatment is understanding
 
00:10:30.576 --> 00:10:34.019
the model around you of resource,
 
00:10:34.298 --> 00:10:35.240
of resourcing.
 
00:10:35.919 --> 00:10:38.142
So I always ask folks when they come in,
 
00:10:39.121 --> 00:10:40.803
where are you lacking resourcing?
 
00:10:40.923 --> 00:10:42.585
Where is your safety and security?
 
00:10:43.240 --> 00:10:45.640
That's number one before we
 
00:10:45.681 --> 00:10:47.261
even talk about self-care
 
00:10:47.402 --> 00:10:49.702
or relaxation response or
 
00:10:49.743 --> 00:10:51.144
even assessing trauma.
 
00:10:51.344 --> 00:10:52.543
It doesn't even matter if we
 
00:10:52.583 --> 00:10:53.965
don't feel like we are
 
00:10:54.225 --> 00:10:55.184
getting our needs met,
 
00:10:55.405 --> 00:10:56.365
safety and security.
 
00:10:56.426 --> 00:10:57.346
And that's really hard.
 
00:10:57.626 --> 00:10:58.427
That's really hard in the
 
00:10:58.447 --> 00:11:00.488
world because with the
 
00:11:01.168 --> 00:11:03.509
changes in family structures.
 
00:11:03.568 --> 00:11:05.029
It could, you know, someone could move,
 
00:11:05.070 --> 00:11:05.769
they could have a change in
 
00:11:05.789 --> 00:11:08.191
their economic status.
 
00:11:08.230 --> 00:11:09.370
Like there's a lot of things
 
00:11:09.390 --> 00:11:10.152
that are really connected
 
00:11:10.172 --> 00:11:12.893
to our safety or that we've tied,
 
00:11:13.173 --> 00:11:13.393
you know,
 
00:11:13.452 --> 00:11:14.854
other people who've tied ourselves,
 
00:11:15.453 --> 00:11:15.953
not necessarily
 
00:11:15.994 --> 00:11:17.294
interdependently in a healthy way,
 
00:11:17.335 --> 00:11:18.375
but even codependently
 
00:11:18.414 --> 00:11:19.816
where our safety can be
 
00:11:19.855 --> 00:11:20.975
threatened at any time.
 
00:11:21.716 --> 00:11:24.937
And that, that psychological safety even.
 
00:11:24.957 --> 00:11:25.457
So it's,
 
00:11:26.357 --> 00:11:27.239
I think that's the biggest
 
00:11:27.298 --> 00:11:28.580
word that I've been
 
00:11:29.081 --> 00:11:30.361
contemplating that's
 
00:11:30.402 --> 00:11:31.283
happening in the world today,
 
00:11:31.302 --> 00:11:32.543
this sense of uncertainty,
 
00:11:33.164 --> 00:11:34.186
that word uncertainty.
 
00:11:34.605 --> 00:11:35.726
And how do we find a sense
 
00:11:35.767 --> 00:11:36.947
of security within that
 
00:11:37.008 --> 00:11:39.471
sense of uncertainty?
 
00:11:39.671 --> 00:11:40.611
My spiritual practice,
 
00:11:40.631 --> 00:11:42.153
and I'm sure some of the
 
00:11:42.452 --> 00:11:43.474
soul care offerings you're
 
00:11:43.494 --> 00:11:44.054
going to share today,
 
00:11:44.095 --> 00:11:44.735
but that's one of the
 
00:11:44.755 --> 00:11:46.496
biggest challenges I think we all have.
 
00:11:47.538 --> 00:11:48.278
Yeah, yeah.
 
00:11:48.938 --> 00:11:51.639
Well, I think I would ask then, you know,
 
00:11:51.700 --> 00:11:53.019
if someone would come to me and ask,
 
00:11:53.080 --> 00:11:55.000
you know, I say they're uncertain, like,
 
00:11:55.061 --> 00:11:56.621
where is that voice coming from?
 
00:11:57.042 --> 00:11:57.741
Is that your voice?
 
00:11:57.761 --> 00:11:58.302
Collectively.
 
00:11:58.562 --> 00:11:59.923
You know, sometimes, yeah,
 
00:11:59.962 --> 00:12:01.023
we're fed a line that
 
00:12:01.163 --> 00:12:02.264
things should be different.
 
00:12:02.644 --> 00:12:04.423
Things should be this way, that way.
 
00:12:06.225 --> 00:12:10.287
And, you know, and it's not.
 
00:12:10.826 --> 00:12:12.326
When we start stepping back, we're like,
 
00:12:12.346 --> 00:12:12.626
wait,
 
00:12:13.148 --> 00:12:14.567
it looks a little differently when
 
00:12:14.587 --> 00:12:15.327
we start looking
 
00:12:15.687 --> 00:12:17.149
objectively at our lives.
 
00:12:17.796 --> 00:12:19.298
about what we can control
 
00:12:19.697 --> 00:12:21.659
and what are the things that we can do.
 
00:12:23.121 --> 00:12:24.884
If we can't advocate for change,
 
00:12:24.984 --> 00:12:26.605
who can advocate for us and
 
00:12:26.645 --> 00:12:28.648
how can we harness a
 
00:12:28.687 --> 00:12:29.469
collective or
 
00:12:29.928 --> 00:12:31.190
interdependence in a way
 
00:12:31.210 --> 00:12:33.793
that's really essential for
 
00:12:33.952 --> 00:12:34.874
any kind of recovery?
 
00:12:36.759 --> 00:12:38.880
I know that what we're moving into,
 
00:12:38.900 --> 00:12:39.542
we're going to talk about
 
00:12:39.562 --> 00:12:40.662
your retreat spaces.
 
00:12:40.741 --> 00:12:42.082
And I know that relates to people.
 
00:12:42.383 --> 00:12:43.244
But I just had a thought.
 
00:12:43.423 --> 00:12:43.984
One of the things we're
 
00:12:44.004 --> 00:12:44.845
going to be talking about
 
00:12:44.904 --> 00:12:45.965
coming up on the podcast
 
00:12:46.004 --> 00:12:47.125
for the themes is community
 
00:12:47.145 --> 00:12:48.866
and connection and creating
 
00:12:48.907 --> 00:12:50.168
safe spaces and community.
 
00:12:50.868 --> 00:12:53.169
And I think about the interconnection,
 
00:12:53.210 --> 00:12:54.389
that word interconnection,
 
00:12:54.509 --> 00:12:55.791
how our culture connects.
 
00:12:56.071 --> 00:12:57.312
I don't know if it truly
 
00:12:57.373 --> 00:12:58.414
understands anymore.
 
00:12:58.455 --> 00:12:59.255
We talked about this in the
 
00:12:59.296 --> 00:13:00.437
past of not having
 
00:13:01.359 --> 00:13:02.580
congregations or churches
 
00:13:02.659 --> 00:13:03.822
or spaces in which people
 
00:13:03.861 --> 00:13:05.083
gather and feel that sense
 
00:13:05.104 --> 00:13:06.666
of security from more of
 
00:13:06.686 --> 00:13:09.068
like a primal communal tribal state.
 
00:13:09.089 --> 00:13:10.110
We just don't have that.
 
00:13:10.851 --> 00:13:12.553
And I'm thinking about this,
 
00:13:12.874 --> 00:13:13.114
you know,
 
00:13:13.214 --> 00:13:14.414
one of the things that has been
 
00:13:14.794 --> 00:13:15.615
the challenge when I said
 
00:13:15.634 --> 00:13:17.316
about the word uncertainties,
 
00:13:17.355 --> 00:13:18.677
I think I see so much.
 
00:13:19.297 --> 00:13:21.697
And my journey recently has
 
00:13:21.758 --> 00:13:23.239
been being that kind of
 
00:13:23.359 --> 00:13:25.580
solid reminder for other people,
 
00:13:25.860 --> 00:13:27.019
it's going to be okay, you know,
 
00:13:27.100 --> 00:13:28.620
and watching kind of I'm like,
 
00:13:28.640 --> 00:13:29.620
I feel like the eye of the
 
00:13:29.640 --> 00:13:30.501
storm and watching the
 
00:13:30.522 --> 00:13:31.501
hurricane all around me
 
00:13:31.562 --> 00:13:32.562
kind of seeing it in the
 
00:13:32.602 --> 00:13:34.082
world of this fear,
 
00:13:34.102 --> 00:13:34.763
this uncertainty that
 
00:13:34.783 --> 00:13:35.744
people are experiencing.
 
00:13:36.203 --> 00:13:37.965
And seeing that it's very
 
00:13:38.024 --> 00:13:40.407
clear sometimes that there are resources,
 
00:13:40.466 --> 00:13:41.407
but not everyone,
 
00:13:41.447 --> 00:13:42.927
when you're in that state, you can't see,
 
00:13:43.229 --> 00:13:43.568
you know?
 
00:13:44.068 --> 00:13:46.971
So I think that self-awareness is like so,
 
00:13:47.150 --> 00:13:48.272
so crucial to the,
 
00:13:48.351 --> 00:13:49.452
in the steps you're asking,
 
00:13:49.493 --> 00:13:50.332
like before you even go
 
00:13:50.393 --> 00:13:51.594
into talking about trauma
 
00:13:51.634 --> 00:13:54.056
or talking about self-care, like,
 
00:13:54.596 --> 00:13:56.297
I think that's very amazing
 
00:13:56.317 --> 00:13:57.097
that you're doing that.
 
00:13:58.038 --> 00:13:59.178
And good to share with, with,
 
00:13:59.239 --> 00:13:59.859
with everyone that's
 
00:13:59.899 --> 00:14:00.759
listening to in case
 
00:14:00.779 --> 00:14:01.880
they're working without someone,
 
00:14:01.921 --> 00:14:03.861
I think it's just like you said,
 
00:14:03.902 --> 00:14:04.903
foundational.
 
00:14:04.942 --> 00:14:05.082
So.
 
00:14:07.583 --> 00:14:08.764
Yeah, I really,
 
00:14:09.105 --> 00:14:10.765
I appreciate you and like
 
00:14:11.005 --> 00:14:12.285
providing a holistic
 
00:14:12.326 --> 00:14:13.846
framework or holistic
 
00:14:13.866 --> 00:14:14.807
trauma informed framework
 
00:14:14.827 --> 00:14:15.768
in the work that you do.
 
00:14:16.307 --> 00:14:16.567
You know,
 
00:14:16.628 --> 00:14:19.129
I think that's more than necessary.
 
00:14:19.149 --> 00:14:19.789
That's awesome.
 
00:14:19.809 --> 00:14:19.889
Yeah.
 
00:14:19.909 --> 00:14:21.870
But yeah,
 
00:14:21.910 --> 00:14:23.971
when you were asking about retreats, like,
 
00:14:24.272 --> 00:14:25.533
so what I, what I've,
 
00:14:26.432 --> 00:14:27.453
what I've noticed through
 
00:14:27.474 --> 00:14:29.054
the years is that
 
00:14:30.082 --> 00:14:34.365
when folks come to therapy
 
00:14:34.384 --> 00:14:38.625
for trauma or therapy for burnout, um,
 
00:14:38.706 --> 00:14:39.647
one of the biggest themes
 
00:14:39.667 --> 00:14:40.726
is disconnection.
 
00:14:40.746 --> 00:14:42.268
So disconnection from self
 
00:14:42.307 --> 00:14:43.528
disconnection from others,
 
00:14:43.587 --> 00:14:44.989
disconnection from the culture,
 
00:14:45.109 --> 00:14:47.210
from your collective, like you said,
 
00:14:47.230 --> 00:14:50.370
like your tribe or your, um, your,
 
00:14:50.630 --> 00:14:51.410
you know, a group.
 
00:14:51.431 --> 00:14:51.551
Yeah.
 
00:14:51.571 --> 00:14:53.932
I mean, it can look like the,
 
00:14:53.951 --> 00:14:55.033
the sort of the crisis of
 
00:14:55.092 --> 00:14:57.313
loneliness here in the States.
 
00:14:57.754 --> 00:14:57.913
Um,
 
00:15:00.062 --> 00:15:02.624
But in general, people just say,
 
00:15:02.984 --> 00:15:04.585
I feel really disconnected.
 
00:15:04.904 --> 00:15:06.625
And the work that I do is
 
00:15:06.765 --> 00:15:08.225
inner compass work.
 
00:15:08.625 --> 00:15:10.126
It's reorienting ourselves
 
00:15:10.187 --> 00:15:13.087
to our own understanding of
 
00:15:13.148 --> 00:15:14.889
connection and then connectivity.
 
00:15:15.408 --> 00:15:16.849
And that always means
 
00:15:17.229 --> 00:15:18.710
understanding with the Root, Grow,
 
00:15:18.750 --> 00:15:20.530
Thrive model rooting into
 
00:15:20.730 --> 00:15:22.471
who are we connected to?
 
00:15:22.510 --> 00:15:23.731
What are the resources?
 
00:15:24.451 --> 00:15:26.373
and people around us who are
 
00:15:26.413 --> 00:15:28.234
part of our story that
 
00:15:28.354 --> 00:15:29.975
looks like ancestors too,
 
00:15:30.815 --> 00:15:34.416
and chosen family in the modern world.
 
00:15:34.996 --> 00:15:37.418
And so it's both and,
 
00:15:37.437 --> 00:15:39.339
it's both holding that
 
00:15:39.418 --> 00:15:40.619
posture of understanding
 
00:15:40.639 --> 00:15:42.139
that we are indeed
 
00:15:42.179 --> 00:15:43.419
connected and how do we
 
00:15:43.880 --> 00:15:44.640
move through that.
 
00:15:45.160 --> 00:15:45.902
So folks,
 
00:15:47.873 --> 00:15:51.255
folks often in burnout, like say that,
 
00:15:51.375 --> 00:15:52.255
okay, I want,
 
00:15:52.416 --> 00:15:53.937
I want to not be burned out.
 
00:15:54.018 --> 00:15:55.658
I want to, you know,
 
00:15:55.698 --> 00:15:56.980
not feel so exhausted.
 
00:15:57.000 --> 00:15:57.700
I, you know,
 
00:15:57.759 --> 00:15:59.000
I want to feel like I have
 
00:15:59.041 --> 00:16:00.081
meaning and purpose.
 
00:16:00.542 --> 00:16:02.563
A lot of that really, um,
 
00:16:02.624 --> 00:16:04.485
I love the word used foundational,
 
00:16:04.524 --> 00:16:07.267
like the understanding the
 
00:16:07.346 --> 00:16:09.629
foundation to reorient
 
00:16:09.668 --> 00:16:11.370
yourself to your core purpose.
 
00:16:12.211 --> 00:16:13.552
Um, and that,
 
00:16:14.028 --> 00:16:16.909
that takes a lot of sitting
 
00:16:16.970 --> 00:16:18.791
with and like if we have
 
00:16:18.811 --> 00:16:20.152
been either traumatized or
 
00:16:20.192 --> 00:16:21.133
under chronic stress
 
00:16:21.312 --> 00:16:23.033
sitting with is not does
 
00:16:23.053 --> 00:16:24.073
not come easy and it
 
00:16:24.134 --> 00:16:25.455
actually is can be very
 
00:16:25.475 --> 00:16:28.197
harmful um and so we have
 
00:16:28.236 --> 00:16:29.278
to have safe
 
00:16:29.298 --> 00:16:31.239
trauma-informed spaces like
 
00:16:31.259 --> 00:16:32.419
with therapy like with
 
00:16:32.440 --> 00:16:33.721
therapeutic retreats like
 
00:16:33.760 --> 00:16:35.282
with you know you guys and
 
00:16:35.302 --> 00:16:36.402
your holistic option
 
00:16:37.222 --> 00:16:38.903
offerings you know what
 
00:16:39.605 --> 00:16:42.246
where can we center in on a
 
00:16:42.307 --> 00:16:43.886
space of openness that we
 
00:16:43.927 --> 00:16:44.886
can start to orient
 
00:16:44.907 --> 00:16:45.847
ourselves to our inner
 
00:16:46.048 --> 00:16:47.427
knowing and our inner
 
00:16:47.827 --> 00:16:48.707
meaning and purpose.
 
00:16:49.187 --> 00:16:51.249
And when we're oriented with that,
 
00:16:51.288 --> 00:16:53.308
we're much more able to see
 
00:16:53.408 --> 00:16:54.850
where we're naturally connected.
 
00:16:55.490 --> 00:16:57.029
It's just, we're not seeing it.
 
00:16:57.649 --> 00:16:59.971
We're just, we're feeling disconnected,
 
00:17:00.051 --> 00:17:02.432
but that is not true.
 
00:17:03.192 --> 00:17:05.031
So we're human living in human skin.
 
00:17:05.392 --> 00:17:06.893
We all have connections.
 
00:17:07.613 --> 00:17:08.272
So, um,
 
00:17:09.163 --> 00:17:11.964
So the therapeutic retreats that I offer,
 
00:17:12.244 --> 00:17:13.244
and we can go into those,
 
00:17:13.285 --> 00:17:15.326
but they really are part
 
00:17:15.506 --> 00:17:20.686
and parcel of that model of
 
00:17:21.366 --> 00:17:25.888
reclaiming yourself with a capital S,
 
00:17:26.229 --> 00:17:26.528
you know.
 
00:17:28.038 --> 00:17:30.279
And so when you're having these retreats,
 
00:17:30.500 --> 00:17:31.340
especially because you're
 
00:17:31.361 --> 00:17:33.082
going to be working in a holistic,
 
00:17:33.122 --> 00:17:34.083
integrative way,
 
00:17:34.702 --> 00:17:37.085
what are some of the ways
 
00:17:37.105 --> 00:17:38.846
you work in the retreat
 
00:17:38.886 --> 00:17:40.367
space with burnout and
 
00:17:40.548 --> 00:17:41.588
maybe some of the mind-body
 
00:17:41.628 --> 00:17:43.611
connections and just some
 
00:17:43.631 --> 00:17:44.330
of the things that you're
 
00:17:44.391 --> 00:17:45.652
noticing as you work in the
 
00:17:45.692 --> 00:17:46.452
tools that you use?
 
00:17:47.825 --> 00:17:48.806
Yeah.
 
00:17:48.865 --> 00:17:49.086
Well,
 
00:17:49.746 --> 00:17:53.328
intensives is a newer model of care
 
00:17:53.449 --> 00:17:54.750
in the therapy world.
 
00:17:55.750 --> 00:17:57.652
Though they've been used through the years,
 
00:17:58.092 --> 00:17:59.792
it's becoming to be more popular.
 
00:18:01.334 --> 00:18:03.016
So the difference between
 
00:18:03.076 --> 00:18:05.037
intensives and individual therapy,
 
00:18:05.096 --> 00:18:06.617
so people in individual
 
00:18:06.678 --> 00:18:07.598
therapy who come to a
 
00:18:07.659 --> 00:18:09.359
therapist maybe on a weekly
 
00:18:09.400 --> 00:18:11.741
basis and maybe for an hour
 
00:18:11.781 --> 00:18:13.423
at a time and talk about
 
00:18:13.863 --> 00:18:15.364
what's going on and do the
 
00:18:15.423 --> 00:18:16.443
model of therapy that the
 
00:18:16.463 --> 00:18:17.585
therapist is trained in
 
00:18:18.585 --> 00:18:20.686
over a span of time.
 
00:18:20.747 --> 00:18:23.048
Retreat intensives, or at least intensives,
 
00:18:23.607 --> 00:18:25.148
are an accelerated,
 
00:18:25.209 --> 00:18:26.650
condensed model of that
 
00:18:26.710 --> 00:18:28.170
into a short amount of time.
 
00:18:29.770 --> 00:18:31.932
And so they usually last
 
00:18:31.951 --> 00:18:34.032
between two to four days
 
00:18:34.353 --> 00:18:36.794
and multiple hours per day.
 
00:18:37.233 --> 00:18:38.734
So that's why it's called an
 
00:18:38.795 --> 00:18:40.615
intensive because it's a
 
00:18:40.675 --> 00:18:42.856
condensed accelerated model.
 
00:18:43.376 --> 00:18:46.117
And the kind of intensives
 
00:18:46.137 --> 00:18:48.719
that I offer because
 
00:18:48.739 --> 00:18:51.019
they're not related to or I
 
00:18:51.099 --> 00:18:52.701
don't take insurance,
 
00:18:52.721 --> 00:18:54.122
so it's not a medical model.
 
00:18:54.741 --> 00:18:57.204
It's a retreat based model.
 
00:18:57.605 --> 00:19:00.087
So for folks that come to me
 
00:19:00.607 --> 00:19:03.530
in burnout and trauma and overwhelm,
 
00:19:03.671 --> 00:19:06.493
just want to reconnect to themselves.
 
00:19:08.737 --> 00:19:09.778
They're almost always
 
00:19:09.817 --> 00:19:12.380
caregiving professionals or therapists,
 
00:19:12.420 --> 00:19:13.741
parents, that kind of thing.
 
00:19:14.201 --> 00:19:17.303
and they need a break so I
 
00:19:17.323 --> 00:19:18.722
mean I get that I mean I'm
 
00:19:18.762 --> 00:19:20.144
a mom myself I'm a
 
00:19:20.203 --> 00:19:21.763
therapist I've been through
 
00:19:21.784 --> 00:19:23.525
burnout myself I know the
 
00:19:23.565 --> 00:19:24.904
importance of that so this
 
00:19:24.924 --> 00:19:26.924
is a curated and um
 
00:19:27.025 --> 00:19:29.526
condensed model of care
 
00:19:29.786 --> 00:19:31.406
that's a one-on-one basis
 
00:19:31.487 --> 00:19:32.606
it's actually online
 
00:19:32.987 --> 00:19:35.229
uh for people in PA because
 
00:19:35.249 --> 00:19:37.931
I'm licensed in PA so um we
 
00:19:37.971 --> 00:19:39.932
would have over several
 
00:19:39.991 --> 00:19:44.214
days um uh to a deep dive
 
00:19:44.496 --> 00:19:46.896
into your your intention
 
00:19:47.518 --> 00:19:49.239
and so we we do an
 
00:19:49.739 --> 00:19:51.580
intention setting session
 
00:19:52.060 --> 00:19:53.102
we do the intensive
 
00:19:53.602 --> 00:19:54.403
then we have a post
 
00:19:54.442 --> 00:19:55.884
intention and intensive
 
00:19:55.943 --> 00:19:58.045
session and during that you
 
00:19:58.065 --> 00:20:00.066
know both of those those
 
00:20:00.125 --> 00:20:01.626
two sessions to start and
 
00:20:01.826 --> 00:20:02.887
end it's really those are
 
00:20:02.928 --> 00:20:04.868
capstones to create a real
 
00:20:04.909 --> 00:20:06.750
nice container for folks to
 
00:20:07.490 --> 00:20:09.511
um initiate their healing
 
00:20:09.551 --> 00:20:11.833
process and then as far as
 
00:20:11.894 --> 00:20:13.473
the groups go are they also
 
00:20:13.515 --> 00:20:15.596
available in person are they only online
 
00:20:17.515 --> 00:20:19.256
so these are one-on-one and
 
00:20:19.355 --> 00:20:20.616
retreat intensives are
 
00:20:20.717 --> 00:20:21.998
one-on-one and they are
 
00:20:22.117 --> 00:20:23.298
absolutely curated and
 
00:20:23.338 --> 00:20:24.680
collaborative for for each
 
00:20:24.720 --> 00:20:25.701
person they're totally
 
00:20:25.760 --> 00:20:28.083
online so by and large the
 
00:20:28.123 --> 00:20:30.104
clients that I see for
 
00:20:30.144 --> 00:20:33.787
retreat intensives they are
 
00:20:34.027 --> 00:20:37.329
motivated to spend um the
 
00:20:37.410 --> 00:20:39.030
time like to take the time
 
00:20:39.191 --> 00:20:42.073
off during their weekday um
 
00:20:42.252 --> 00:20:45.276
or weekend and often take
 
00:20:46.415 --> 00:20:47.936
like an Airbnb or some kind
 
00:20:47.997 --> 00:20:49.538
of space to get away so
 
00:20:49.577 --> 00:20:51.557
that they have a space to
 
00:20:51.618 --> 00:20:54.559
do their work outside of their home.
 
00:20:54.980 --> 00:20:56.540
In part because most of the
 
00:20:56.580 --> 00:20:57.701
folks that I see are
 
00:20:57.740 --> 00:20:59.221
caregivers as well as home
 
00:20:59.241 --> 00:21:01.522
and needing to get out of
 
00:21:01.563 --> 00:21:04.384
their own home is part of
 
00:21:04.423 --> 00:21:08.346
the work and part of the need for
 
00:21:09.306 --> 00:21:09.967
a container.
 
00:21:10.446 --> 00:21:13.769
So it is online and it
 
00:21:13.788 --> 00:21:14.489
doesn't mean that we're
 
00:21:14.589 --> 00:21:17.171
sitting doing therapy like
 
00:21:17.371 --> 00:21:18.872
one on one with your face
 
00:21:18.912 --> 00:21:20.192
and a screen the whole time.
 
00:21:21.005 --> 00:21:23.007
The kind of therapy I do, we get up,
 
00:21:23.346 --> 00:21:25.689
we have creative practice
 
00:21:25.808 --> 00:21:27.711
almost throughout the entire time.
 
00:21:28.570 --> 00:21:30.772
We turn off our screens, we go outside.
 
00:21:31.693 --> 00:21:32.974
It's a very facilitated
 
00:21:33.035 --> 00:21:34.195
model for movement and
 
00:21:34.215 --> 00:21:35.876
embodied experience.
 
00:21:38.680 --> 00:21:40.740
Every therapist has their own model.
 
00:21:41.162 --> 00:21:42.982
I'm just describing the ones that I do,
 
00:21:43.022 --> 00:21:44.463
but there's lots of
 
00:21:44.503 --> 00:21:45.305
therapists out there that
 
00:21:45.325 --> 00:21:48.748
do intensives and they're all curated.
 
00:21:49.127 --> 00:21:50.450
they tend to be very curated
 
00:21:50.509 --> 00:21:52.432
to the experience of of
 
00:21:52.473 --> 00:21:53.875
what your needs are that's
 
00:21:54.016 --> 00:21:54.916
awesome and especially if
 
00:21:54.957 --> 00:21:56.038
you've been burned out you
 
00:21:56.058 --> 00:21:56.941
know the last thing you
 
00:21:56.961 --> 00:21:57.942
really want to do is go
 
00:21:58.041 --> 00:21:59.044
somewhere travel on an
 
00:21:59.163 --> 00:22:01.067
airplane or long you know
 
00:22:01.106 --> 00:22:02.128
sometimes you just want to be
 
00:22:03.145 --> 00:22:04.747
in permit mode by yourself,
 
00:22:04.807 --> 00:22:05.686
not with a lot of other
 
00:22:05.727 --> 00:22:07.886
people in a space where it's a group.
 
00:22:08.248 --> 00:22:09.127
Because I know that that is
 
00:22:09.268 --> 00:22:10.387
also an option for people.
 
00:22:10.428 --> 00:22:11.387
Sometimes the people have
 
00:22:11.407 --> 00:22:13.588
been so disconnected and
 
00:22:13.888 --> 00:22:14.910
that connection I think
 
00:22:14.950 --> 00:22:16.029
sometimes is what helps
 
00:22:16.109 --> 00:22:17.690
people come back online and
 
00:22:17.730 --> 00:22:18.790
get that sense of purpose
 
00:22:18.830 --> 00:22:19.851
and connecting through
 
00:22:19.891 --> 00:22:20.990
other people's stories and
 
00:22:21.030 --> 00:22:22.412
seeing that they're not alone too.
 
00:22:22.471 --> 00:22:22.872
So there's,
 
00:22:23.092 --> 00:22:23.991
I love that you have this
 
00:22:24.531 --> 00:22:26.212
really beautiful option for people.
 
00:22:27.816 --> 00:22:27.955
Now,
 
00:22:28.036 --> 00:22:30.576
I know that we haven't even done a lot
 
00:22:30.616 --> 00:22:33.038
of any more episodes about
 
00:22:33.278 --> 00:22:34.357
you and some of the other
 
00:22:34.458 --> 00:22:35.298
offerings you offer
 
00:22:35.459 --> 00:22:37.440
integratively as far as
 
00:22:37.480 --> 00:22:38.519
spiritually as well.
 
00:22:38.940 --> 00:22:40.441
I'd love to learn more about
 
00:22:40.760 --> 00:22:42.221
how you incorporate some of
 
00:22:42.260 --> 00:22:43.321
these modalities that you
 
00:22:43.461 --> 00:22:45.603
offer because you are a
 
00:22:45.823 --> 00:22:47.542
dream work therapist and
 
00:22:47.942 --> 00:22:50.483
you practice astrology and tarot,
 
00:22:50.564 --> 00:22:51.525
and I'd love to see how...
 
00:22:52.224 --> 00:22:52.924
those when they're
 
00:22:52.964 --> 00:22:54.185
appropriate for a client of
 
00:22:54.226 --> 00:22:54.846
course when they get
 
00:22:54.885 --> 00:22:56.246
permission you know consent
 
00:22:56.487 --> 00:22:56.967
and that they're really
 
00:22:57.027 --> 00:22:58.207
into that what is the
 
00:22:58.267 --> 00:22:59.287
process for that and how
 
00:22:59.307 --> 00:23:01.167
does that work with your
 
00:23:01.528 --> 00:23:04.308
approach yeah that's what's
 
00:23:04.449 --> 00:23:06.049
like so great about
 
00:23:06.130 --> 00:23:06.890
especially about the
 
00:23:06.930 --> 00:23:09.351
intensives um is that they give
 
00:23:10.167 --> 00:23:11.688
Because they're a container,
 
00:23:11.768 --> 00:23:13.388
we can really do deep dives
 
00:23:13.509 --> 00:23:15.048
into models of care that
 
00:23:15.088 --> 00:23:17.890
are just innovative and
 
00:23:19.430 --> 00:23:22.471
really exploratory in a way
 
00:23:22.490 --> 00:23:23.791
that maybe weekly therapy
 
00:23:23.852 --> 00:23:25.632
just don't get to sometimes
 
00:23:25.892 --> 00:23:27.173
with just like coming up
 
00:23:27.313 --> 00:23:29.452
with what's going on in your life, right?
 
00:23:30.373 --> 00:23:32.554
It's very an intentional container, right?
 
00:23:33.654 --> 00:23:35.255
So yeah, I am, um,
 
00:23:35.275 --> 00:23:36.715
trained as a spiritual
 
00:23:36.736 --> 00:23:39.476
director in the union mystical tradition,
 
00:23:40.135 --> 00:23:41.336
um, for the Hayden Institute.
 
00:23:41.396 --> 00:23:43.436
So I have dream work
 
00:23:43.497 --> 00:23:44.977
experience going back to
 
00:23:45.017 --> 00:23:47.258
when I was actually a teen, um,
 
00:23:47.278 --> 00:23:48.698
doing dream work since then.
 
00:23:49.018 --> 00:23:49.998
And, um,
 
00:23:50.117 --> 00:23:51.138
I have at least ten years
 
00:23:51.179 --> 00:23:53.298
experience working the tarot as well as,
 
00:23:53.999 --> 00:23:56.480
um, about five years, uh,
 
00:23:56.500 --> 00:23:58.400
diving into natal astrology.
 
00:23:59.115 --> 00:24:02.577
And mostly because I just
 
00:24:02.718 --> 00:24:07.382
find all of that to be such
 
00:24:07.481 --> 00:24:08.561
language of the soul.
 
00:24:08.761 --> 00:24:10.723
In general,
 
00:24:10.763 --> 00:24:12.224
the kind of orientation that I
 
00:24:12.285 --> 00:24:16.007
have in my therapy, it's soul care.
 
00:24:16.508 --> 00:24:18.788
It's not just psychological care.
 
00:24:19.169 --> 00:24:21.290
It's not just checking off a box of like,
 
00:24:21.330 --> 00:24:22.531
how can I stress less?
 
00:24:23.705 --> 00:24:25.526
yeah we do that but we also
 
00:24:25.705 --> 00:24:26.886
you know care for the soul
 
00:24:26.967 --> 00:24:30.048
and so folks um when they
 
00:24:30.307 --> 00:24:32.728
are uh you know terror
 
00:24:32.748 --> 00:24:34.228
readers themselves or when
 
00:24:34.268 --> 00:24:36.209
they have creative outlets
 
00:24:36.249 --> 00:24:37.409
or they they're creatives
 
00:24:37.608 --> 00:24:42.349
or um they they crave sort
 
00:24:42.410 --> 00:24:45.191
of a spiritual lens on
 
00:24:45.790 --> 00:24:47.612
their life which most of us
 
00:24:47.632 --> 00:24:49.031
do when we're looking at
 
00:24:49.071 --> 00:24:50.791
meaning and purpose most of
 
00:24:50.832 --> 00:24:53.232
us do um really want
 
00:24:53.692 --> 00:24:55.654
something wider than just
 
00:24:55.714 --> 00:24:58.337
the everyday um then then I
 
00:24:58.538 --> 00:25:00.319
I'm like a polyglot when it
 
00:25:00.359 --> 00:25:01.521
comes to this stuff I can
 
00:25:01.561 --> 00:25:03.683
talk about it um and I can
 
00:25:03.864 --> 00:25:06.406
I can assist folks in using
 
00:25:06.446 --> 00:25:08.068
it the way uh that would
 
00:25:08.088 --> 00:25:10.030
help them so the way that I
 
00:25:10.111 --> 00:25:13.213
orient myself towards for instance tarot
 
00:25:13.806 --> 00:25:16.728
in integrative retreats
 
00:25:16.768 --> 00:25:21.530
would be if they want to
 
00:25:21.711 --> 00:25:23.092
use it and they're really
 
00:25:23.132 --> 00:25:25.772
curious about it,
 
00:25:26.053 --> 00:25:26.874
I use it as like a
 
00:25:26.933 --> 00:25:30.496
projective model of introspection.
 
00:25:30.576 --> 00:25:34.719
So to use it similar to art therapy,
 
00:25:35.919 --> 00:25:37.340
or other creative models of
 
00:25:37.401 --> 00:25:39.801
projection that help us see
 
00:25:39.842 --> 00:25:41.284
our size outside ourselves.
 
00:25:42.324 --> 00:25:43.605
Most of us have experience
 
00:25:43.644 --> 00:25:46.948
of seeing a piece of art
 
00:25:47.067 --> 00:25:50.150
and just really feeling a
 
00:25:50.190 --> 00:25:52.251
tremendous amount of feelings with it.
 
00:25:52.291 --> 00:25:53.472
There's something about this
 
00:25:53.512 --> 00:25:55.894
piece of art that just draws me in.
 
00:25:56.734 --> 00:25:57.895
And so that's similar to
 
00:25:57.955 --> 00:26:00.238
what we do when it comes to using tarot,
 
00:26:00.768 --> 00:26:02.730
except we use archetypal imagery.
 
00:26:03.170 --> 00:26:05.731
We use collective kind of
 
00:26:07.532 --> 00:26:09.474
imagery that resonates not
 
00:26:09.515 --> 00:26:12.777
just with one person.
 
00:26:12.896 --> 00:26:15.459
It's not just your story, it's our story.
 
00:26:16.900 --> 00:26:18.801
And so we do that.
 
00:26:18.922 --> 00:26:19.682
And then dream work is
 
00:26:19.721 --> 00:26:21.063
similar to that as well.
 
00:26:21.503 --> 00:26:24.846
When people are coming in with dreams,
 
00:26:25.287 --> 00:26:27.087
it's intensely sacred.
 
00:26:27.929 --> 00:26:28.788
Dreams are...
 
00:26:30.069 --> 00:26:32.133
are just beautifully sacred
 
00:26:32.413 --> 00:26:34.355
and so we're held in a
 
00:26:34.414 --> 00:26:37.178
model of what this means
 
00:26:37.258 --> 00:26:38.839
for the client you know not
 
00:26:38.940 --> 00:26:41.943
me judging what their words
 
00:26:42.044 --> 00:26:44.006
are even guiding them to
 
00:26:44.066 --> 00:26:46.568
say like this is what it means but rather
 
00:26:47.465 --> 00:26:48.968
knowing the bigger story,
 
00:26:49.449 --> 00:26:50.569
understanding where they're
 
00:26:50.589 --> 00:26:52.031
coming from with their own,
 
00:26:52.673 --> 00:26:53.815
either their challenges or
 
00:26:53.835 --> 00:26:56.317
their intention for healing.
 
00:26:56.858 --> 00:26:57.980
And then how can this dream
 
00:26:58.019 --> 00:27:00.083
be part of that story to
 
00:27:00.163 --> 00:27:03.106
initiate yourself closer to
 
00:27:03.146 --> 00:27:04.929
your meaning and purpose or your center?
 
00:27:05.349 --> 00:27:06.711
if that makes sense.
 
00:27:06.730 --> 00:27:08.071
I think that the fact that
 
00:27:08.112 --> 00:27:10.114
you are using these things,
 
00:27:10.153 --> 00:27:11.894
I think that the desire to
 
00:27:11.954 --> 00:27:13.916
know the self in a deeper
 
00:27:13.977 --> 00:27:15.998
way is what drives the
 
00:27:16.077 --> 00:27:17.338
opening in the doorway for
 
00:27:17.960 --> 00:27:19.320
expansion into utilizing
 
00:27:19.361 --> 00:27:20.201
these modalities.
 
00:27:20.241 --> 00:27:22.804
And I think that in my opinion,
 
00:27:24.147 --> 00:27:25.710
I can understand for years,
 
00:27:26.131 --> 00:27:27.692
as I've learned astrology
 
00:27:27.732 --> 00:27:29.015
and tarot and dream work
 
00:27:29.035 --> 00:27:29.715
and many different
 
00:27:29.736 --> 00:27:31.479
modalities for exploring the self,
 
00:27:32.099 --> 00:27:33.701
I was so confused as for
 
00:27:33.741 --> 00:27:34.963
years and years of therapy
 
00:27:34.983 --> 00:27:35.565
that I went through.
 
00:27:35.585 --> 00:27:35.785
I was like,
 
00:27:35.884 --> 00:27:37.146
why did they never ask me about
 
00:27:37.166 --> 00:27:37.768
my dreams?
 
00:27:38.347 --> 00:27:39.750
Why did we never talk about them?
 
00:27:40.211 --> 00:27:41.830
why did we never explore
 
00:27:41.891 --> 00:27:43.791
through meditation or, you know,
 
00:27:43.811 --> 00:27:46.751
this internal sense, the felt sense,
 
00:27:46.811 --> 00:27:48.932
the awareness, you know, it was more just,
 
00:27:48.992 --> 00:27:50.712
let's just regurgitate and
 
00:27:50.752 --> 00:27:52.433
chat and hamster wheel.
 
00:27:52.473 --> 00:27:53.673
And what was the biggest stress?
 
00:27:53.814 --> 00:27:53.973
Like,
 
00:27:54.354 --> 00:27:55.433
and I understand there's different
 
00:27:55.453 --> 00:27:56.255
types of therapy in
 
00:27:56.295 --> 00:27:58.214
different ways that you're working with,
 
00:27:58.234 --> 00:27:59.414
um,
 
00:27:59.474 --> 00:28:01.476
either behaviorally or cognitively or
 
00:28:01.576 --> 00:28:02.115
whatever, but
 
00:28:02.955 --> 00:28:03.656
It just wasn't the right
 
00:28:03.696 --> 00:28:06.538
care for me because I've
 
00:28:06.557 --> 00:28:07.699
always been that deep person.
 
00:28:08.378 --> 00:28:08.960
I picked up my first
 
00:28:08.980 --> 00:28:09.839
astrology book when I was
 
00:28:09.900 --> 00:28:13.281
fourteen and I was like, let's do this.
 
00:28:13.301 --> 00:28:16.864
When I first met you,
 
00:28:17.244 --> 00:28:18.045
I've said this in the last
 
00:28:18.105 --> 00:28:19.685
episode or the one before,
 
00:28:19.726 --> 00:28:21.606
I was just so excited to
 
00:28:21.906 --> 00:28:23.647
meet someone in the
 
00:28:23.688 --> 00:28:24.709
licensed psychotherapy
 
00:28:24.749 --> 00:28:26.049
world that is embracing
 
00:28:26.089 --> 00:28:27.830
these tools because it
 
00:28:28.090 --> 00:28:28.911
never made sense to me why
 
00:28:28.931 --> 00:28:29.832
they're not integrated when
 
00:28:29.852 --> 00:28:31.113
they're appropriate, of course.
 
00:28:31.732 --> 00:28:33.574
Yeah, when they're appropriate.
 
00:28:33.694 --> 00:28:34.694
I mean,
 
00:28:36.016 --> 00:28:38.218
I am extremely privileged to be
 
00:28:38.278 --> 00:28:40.318
outside of a medical model here,
 
00:28:40.558 --> 00:28:41.640
yet also within it.
 
00:28:41.980 --> 00:28:43.701
So the fact that I'm a licensed therapist,
 
00:28:43.781 --> 00:28:44.001
yes,
 
00:28:44.122 --> 00:28:46.564
I have to hold myself accountable to
 
00:28:46.584 --> 00:28:47.544
an ethical code.
 
00:28:48.025 --> 00:28:50.226
And that everything that I do with therapy,
 
00:28:50.567 --> 00:28:51.787
clients especially,
 
00:28:52.387 --> 00:28:55.009
is guiding them towards an
 
00:28:55.089 --> 00:28:57.832
intention or goal, right, of healing.
 
00:28:58.791 --> 00:28:59.492
I would be...
 
00:29:00.382 --> 00:29:01.403
not treating someone
 
00:29:01.442 --> 00:29:02.183
otherwise I wouldn't I
 
00:29:02.203 --> 00:29:03.605
couldn't be calling myself
 
00:29:03.964 --> 00:29:04.726
a licensed therapist
 
00:29:04.766 --> 00:29:06.487
otherwise but like within
 
00:29:06.527 --> 00:29:07.887
that model we can really
 
00:29:08.028 --> 00:29:12.092
hold innovation as as
 
00:29:12.352 --> 00:29:13.792
opportunity for in
 
00:29:13.833 --> 00:29:15.815
curiosity and like those
 
00:29:15.835 --> 00:29:17.576
are the things that get
 
00:29:17.655 --> 00:29:19.198
thrown out like baby with
 
00:29:19.218 --> 00:29:21.980
the bathwater with narrow
 
00:29:22.019 --> 00:29:24.821
mindset but also a
 
00:29:25.323 --> 00:29:27.884
fear-based mindset yeah of healing
 
00:29:28.672 --> 00:29:32.794
that is part and parcel to
 
00:29:33.493 --> 00:29:35.555
the reason why my clients are burned out,
 
00:29:36.296 --> 00:29:39.277
especially those in health care.
 
00:29:40.597 --> 00:29:43.199
If you're coming from a model of fear,
 
00:29:43.579 --> 00:29:45.559
then everything's going to
 
00:29:45.601 --> 00:29:47.741
narrow and it's not
 
00:29:47.801 --> 00:29:49.241
necessarily going to be in
 
00:29:49.382 --> 00:29:51.303
service for your healing
 
00:29:51.383 --> 00:29:54.005
and your wholeness and opportunity there.
 
00:29:55.054 --> 00:29:56.415
So for those of us who have
 
00:29:56.455 --> 00:29:58.157
never had maybe an
 
00:29:58.178 --> 00:29:59.339
astrology or a tarot
 
00:29:59.359 --> 00:30:00.622
reading or even done any
 
00:30:00.662 --> 00:30:02.743
dream work or had anything like that,
 
00:30:03.384 --> 00:30:05.688
is there any practical examples,
 
00:30:05.788 --> 00:30:07.049
whether anecdotal or
 
00:30:07.170 --> 00:30:07.991
examples you could come up
 
00:30:08.031 --> 00:30:09.693
with that we would see
 
00:30:11.015 --> 00:30:12.236
An example of me telling you, like,
 
00:30:12.316 --> 00:30:13.217
I'd tell you my dream.
 
00:30:13.636 --> 00:30:14.298
And like,
 
00:30:14.758 --> 00:30:16.038
what would that look like as far
 
00:30:16.179 --> 00:30:19.001
as maybe the process of the dream?
 
00:30:19.021 --> 00:30:20.702
Maybe what is an example of
 
00:30:20.742 --> 00:30:21.903
a dream that someone could have?
 
00:30:21.943 --> 00:30:23.365
And then the process of
 
00:30:23.384 --> 00:30:25.105
working through that dream with you.
 
00:30:25.286 --> 00:30:26.227
And I'd love to do that if
 
00:30:26.267 --> 00:30:27.887
possible for either the dream work,
 
00:30:27.907 --> 00:30:29.410
the tarot or astrology are
 
00:30:29.470 --> 00:30:30.390
all like some practical
 
00:30:30.430 --> 00:30:31.872
examples of what that looks like.
 
00:30:32.592 --> 00:30:32.932
Yeah,
 
00:30:33.051 --> 00:30:35.272
like it depends on what the hat that
 
00:30:35.313 --> 00:30:36.294
I'm wearing at the time.
 
00:30:36.314 --> 00:30:37.114
Right.
 
00:30:37.153 --> 00:30:38.474
Because like if I'm if I'm a
 
00:30:38.535 --> 00:30:39.655
therapist at the time,
 
00:30:40.135 --> 00:30:41.016
generally you have a
 
00:30:41.036 --> 00:30:42.817
relationship with me that
 
00:30:42.957 --> 00:30:44.678
it becomes organic and they
 
00:30:44.778 --> 00:30:45.939
know that they can bring
 
00:30:45.979 --> 00:30:47.578
dreams in at any time.
 
00:30:47.980 --> 00:30:49.660
So if they're bringing a dream in,
 
00:30:49.680 --> 00:30:51.641
then it's like, stop, stop the tracks.
 
00:30:52.821 --> 00:30:54.542
This is like it's a sacred moment.
 
00:30:55.182 --> 00:30:56.483
Anytime anyone ever brings
 
00:30:56.604 --> 00:30:57.644
dreams into session,
 
00:30:59.946 --> 00:31:01.228
I think we just minimize that.
 
00:31:01.268 --> 00:31:02.728
I'm not sure why culturally,
 
00:31:02.827 --> 00:31:04.148
but the fact that people
 
00:31:04.209 --> 00:31:05.829
willing to share their
 
00:31:05.910 --> 00:31:07.009
liminal space and their
 
00:31:07.049 --> 00:31:08.570
liminal knowledge that's
 
00:31:08.730 --> 00:31:10.471
highly connected to soul,
 
00:31:11.885 --> 00:31:13.067
it's a sacred moment that I
 
00:31:13.086 --> 00:31:14.487
get to witness and so I
 
00:31:14.527 --> 00:31:16.028
just mirror that back to
 
00:31:16.067 --> 00:31:17.308
folks that you're willing
 
00:31:17.368 --> 00:31:18.769
to do this vulnerable work
 
00:31:19.150 --> 00:31:21.191
so be able to so in a
 
00:31:21.211 --> 00:31:22.612
therapeutic mindset we
 
00:31:22.811 --> 00:31:23.451
acknowledge the
 
00:31:23.471 --> 00:31:24.573
vulnerability of what it
 
00:31:24.613 --> 00:31:26.413
means to um to process
 
00:31:26.453 --> 00:31:27.993
dreams and then the fact
 
00:31:28.035 --> 00:31:29.734
that I already know some of
 
00:31:29.775 --> 00:31:31.756
their story and what
 
00:31:31.776 --> 00:31:33.136
they're working on quote
 
00:31:33.176 --> 00:31:34.218
unquote working on
 
00:31:36.619 --> 00:31:41.324
then we can both explore the
 
00:31:41.403 --> 00:31:42.805
archetypal meanings of
 
00:31:42.884 --> 00:31:44.406
symbolism in the dream,
 
00:31:44.547 --> 00:31:47.229
as well as me mirroring
 
00:31:47.269 --> 00:31:48.730
back what I'm seeing in the
 
00:31:48.770 --> 00:31:50.092
client as to what is
 
00:31:50.152 --> 00:31:53.275
resonating the most in those images,
 
00:31:53.714 --> 00:31:56.018
as to what exactly the
 
00:31:56.038 --> 00:31:57.378
dream could be inviting us
 
00:31:57.818 --> 00:32:00.481
further openness towards.
 
00:32:01.022 --> 00:32:02.743
Dreams always come in the
 
00:32:02.763 --> 00:32:04.105
service of health and wholeness.
 
00:32:04.385 --> 00:32:04.967
Always.
 
00:32:05.247 --> 00:32:06.627
Even the horrible ones,
 
00:32:06.788 --> 00:32:08.711
even the nightmares.
 
00:32:09.230 --> 00:32:10.451
People don't believe that,
 
00:32:10.471 --> 00:32:12.775
but I promise you, always.
 
00:32:13.419 --> 00:32:15.038
so um so dream work is
 
00:32:15.138 --> 00:32:16.200
really about health and
 
00:32:16.240 --> 00:32:17.579
wholeness and really about
 
00:32:17.619 --> 00:32:18.779
vulnerability and opening
 
00:32:18.839 --> 00:32:20.200
up to that so in the
 
00:32:20.220 --> 00:32:21.319
therapeutic model it's
 
00:32:21.400 --> 00:32:23.121
towards the those health
 
00:32:23.141 --> 00:32:24.040
and wholeness critical
 
00:32:24.080 --> 00:32:25.461
goals or intentions that
 
00:32:25.520 --> 00:32:27.541
we're working on but I also
 
00:32:27.682 --> 00:32:28.602
offer as a spiritual
 
00:32:28.622 --> 00:32:29.682
director dream work
 
00:32:29.721 --> 00:32:31.541
sessions yeah and those are
 
00:32:31.602 --> 00:32:32.241
it's a little bit of a
 
00:32:32.281 --> 00:32:33.182
different model and that
 
00:32:33.222 --> 00:32:34.663
people come they know
 
00:32:34.803 --> 00:32:35.843
they're coming with a dream
 
00:32:35.982 --> 00:32:36.542
and then we're going to
 
00:32:36.583 --> 00:32:38.384
process it together and I'm
 
00:32:38.423 --> 00:32:40.644
going to just offer projections of my own
 
00:32:41.243 --> 00:32:42.785
onto the dream if this were
 
00:32:42.845 --> 00:32:44.726
my dream if this were my
 
00:32:44.766 --> 00:32:46.946
dream that's how I work
 
00:32:46.967 --> 00:32:48.708
with it so I really orient
 
00:32:48.728 --> 00:32:49.989
myself to understanding
 
00:32:50.028 --> 00:32:51.108
like it's not my dream but
 
00:32:51.128 --> 00:32:53.049
it is too yeah so the
 
00:32:53.130 --> 00:32:54.570
jungian model of collective
 
00:32:54.611 --> 00:32:56.231
unconscious google it if
 
00:32:56.291 --> 00:32:57.873
you're not aware of it it's
 
00:32:58.472 --> 00:33:00.273
fantastic but the whole
 
00:33:00.334 --> 00:33:03.056
idea that all dreams are all of ours
 
00:33:04.209 --> 00:33:06.570
feels like a, but it's true.
 
00:33:06.590 --> 00:33:08.132
Um, and working.
 
00:33:08.231 --> 00:33:09.373
So like if people are
 
00:33:09.432 --> 00:33:11.914
sharing their dreams and I get to,
 
00:33:12.336 --> 00:33:13.676
to project onto it,
 
00:33:13.876 --> 00:33:16.118
it can really give them an aha.
 
00:33:16.278 --> 00:33:17.819
It's like, oh, I didn't see it that way.
 
00:33:17.839 --> 00:33:18.059
Yeah.
 
00:33:18.299 --> 00:33:19.721
And see it that way.
 
00:33:19.821 --> 00:33:21.343
And so usually by the end of
 
00:33:21.383 --> 00:33:24.105
those spiritual direction slash soul care,
 
00:33:24.125 --> 00:33:25.946
dream work sessions, they're not therapy.
 
00:33:26.007 --> 00:33:27.508
It's, it's a separate therapy.
 
00:33:28.788 --> 00:33:31.750
people go away with wheels turning.
 
00:33:32.191 --> 00:33:33.971
And I almost always offer
 
00:33:34.132 --> 00:33:38.375
them the suggestion to ask
 
00:33:38.494 --> 00:33:41.517
Dream Wisdom to give them another dream,
 
00:33:42.097 --> 00:33:43.439
to offer another dream.
 
00:33:44.278 --> 00:33:45.601
after we're done processing
 
00:33:45.641 --> 00:33:48.705
in order to keep the
 
00:33:48.746 --> 00:33:53.173
creative ahas alive so that
 
00:33:53.613 --> 00:33:54.775
it will keep moving in the
 
00:33:54.795 --> 00:33:56.076
direction of understanding
 
00:33:56.116 --> 00:33:57.638
what these images really
 
00:33:57.679 --> 00:33:59.060
mean for you and me.
 
00:34:00.125 --> 00:34:01.146
One of the dreams that I
 
00:34:01.207 --> 00:34:02.768
process through and I'll
 
00:34:02.788 --> 00:34:06.109
share through my burnout,
 
00:34:06.329 --> 00:34:07.130
one of my reoccurring
 
00:34:07.170 --> 00:34:08.791
dreams in my journey is
 
00:34:08.831 --> 00:34:10.172
being at water parks and
 
00:34:10.211 --> 00:34:12.634
being with water in a fun way.
 
00:34:13.094 --> 00:34:15.175
So water to me represents emotion.
 
00:34:15.356 --> 00:34:16.655
I love deep emotion.
 
00:34:16.815 --> 00:34:17.416
I love art.
 
00:34:17.476 --> 00:34:18.097
I love music.
 
00:34:18.157 --> 00:34:18.858
I love song.
 
00:34:18.898 --> 00:34:20.518
It's like a deep part of who I am.
 
00:34:21.478 --> 00:34:23.519
And during the process of my
 
00:34:23.561 --> 00:34:24.880
burnout and having to
 
00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:26.561
handle the role of multiple
 
00:34:26.641 --> 00:34:27.443
admin positions,
 
00:34:27.862 --> 00:34:29.324
I had to shut down a lot of
 
00:34:29.364 --> 00:34:30.885
my emotional response.
 
00:34:30.965 --> 00:34:33.445
You can't really, even though you get it,
 
00:34:33.485 --> 00:34:35.126
you have to just, you know, oh,
 
00:34:35.146 --> 00:34:36.027
you gotta do black and white,
 
00:34:36.047 --> 00:34:37.088
you gotta keep going
 
00:34:37.128 --> 00:34:38.289
because there's a lot of
 
00:34:38.329 --> 00:34:39.329
things to do and you can't
 
00:34:39.349 --> 00:34:40.469
get lost in the emotion
 
00:34:40.489 --> 00:34:41.130
because you won't be
 
00:34:41.170 --> 00:34:42.871
productive and then you'll
 
00:34:42.891 --> 00:34:43.891
get farther behind.
 
00:34:44.371 --> 00:34:45.753
So what's really interesting
 
00:34:45.813 --> 00:34:46.873
is I started having my
 
00:34:46.934 --> 00:34:48.695
dreams come back online
 
00:34:49.255 --> 00:34:50.635
and started having dreams
 
00:34:50.675 --> 00:34:52.956
about water parks again it
 
00:34:52.996 --> 00:34:55.418
was a good sign for me um
 
00:34:55.599 --> 00:34:57.579
yeah it was like I'm having
 
00:34:57.619 --> 00:34:59.362
water dreams again I'm I'm
 
00:34:59.641 --> 00:35:01.262
in hawaii on the waves and
 
00:35:01.342 --> 00:35:02.623
I'm like it's always these
 
00:35:02.664 --> 00:35:04.304
like beautiful spaces and
 
00:35:04.505 --> 00:35:06.025
um and my emotions turn
 
00:35:06.045 --> 00:35:07.126
back online a lot this was
 
00:35:07.146 --> 00:35:09.108
a lot of doing kundalini practice too for
 
00:35:09.907 --> 00:35:10.849
and a lot of body work to
 
00:35:10.889 --> 00:35:12.130
release that nervous system
 
00:35:12.170 --> 00:35:12.971
response so I could get
 
00:35:13.010 --> 00:35:14.291
into that emotional space.
 
00:35:15.233 --> 00:35:16.755
But I feel like if I was
 
00:35:16.775 --> 00:35:17.474
working with you and you
 
00:35:17.494 --> 00:35:18.456
knew my backstory,
 
00:35:19.717 --> 00:35:20.597
that processing would be
 
00:35:20.657 --> 00:35:21.478
even deeper because you
 
00:35:21.498 --> 00:35:22.780
have so many reflection points.
 
00:35:22.860 --> 00:35:23.460
So I just wanted to give
 
00:35:23.481 --> 00:35:25.402
that as an example to
 
00:35:25.483 --> 00:35:26.483
anyone out there that's
 
00:35:26.543 --> 00:35:27.764
never had any sort of dream
 
00:35:27.985 --> 00:35:28.925
or even looked at dream
 
00:35:28.945 --> 00:35:30.047
dictionaries for themselves.
 
00:35:30.387 --> 00:35:31.347
But that's just for me.
 
00:35:31.407 --> 00:35:31.887
And that's been a
 
00:35:31.987 --> 00:35:33.708
reoccurring dream my entire life.
 
00:35:34.389 --> 00:35:35.269
I love water parks,
 
00:35:35.389 --> 00:35:37.231
not really in the physical world,
 
00:35:37.251 --> 00:35:38.471
but just in my dreams.
 
00:35:38.510 --> 00:35:40.411
Like I love to play in
 
00:35:40.472 --> 00:35:42.893
emotion and experience deep emotion.
 
00:35:43.853 --> 00:35:45.195
So, yeah.
 
00:35:45.295 --> 00:35:45.534
Yeah.
 
00:35:46.315 --> 00:35:46.635
Yeah.
 
00:35:46.655 --> 00:35:47.655
And the tarot has been
 
00:35:47.695 --> 00:35:49.115
really paramount too.
 
00:35:50.396 --> 00:35:51.918
What's really interesting is
 
00:35:51.978 --> 00:35:54.679
during the burnout process of, okay,
 
00:35:54.699 --> 00:35:55.378
we don't have these
 
00:35:55.418 --> 00:35:56.679
administration positions,
 
00:35:56.719 --> 00:35:58.000
Kara has to do them.
 
00:35:58.701 --> 00:36:00.420
No matter what I did,
 
00:36:00.760 --> 00:36:01.862
I would shuffle the cards
 
00:36:01.882 --> 00:36:04.143
and I would pull the emperor card.
 
00:36:05.210 --> 00:36:07.411
And the fours, always the fours.
 
00:36:08.271 --> 00:36:11.032
And so in my office manager, Emily,
 
00:36:11.273 --> 00:36:11.693
at the time,
 
00:36:11.773 --> 00:36:13.393
she kept starting to see the fours too.
 
00:36:13.432 --> 00:36:14.753
Like we just see repeating numbers,
 
00:36:14.813 --> 00:36:16.213
fours all the time, four, four, four.
 
00:36:16.793 --> 00:36:18.074
And to me, I said to her,
 
00:36:18.653 --> 00:36:20.795
it is a reminder to my soul
 
00:36:20.974 --> 00:36:22.114
that you just need to keep
 
00:36:22.155 --> 00:36:23.416
going with the structure
 
00:36:23.755 --> 00:36:25.916
and continue to create the stability.
 
00:36:26.056 --> 00:36:27.757
Cause you know, for those of you,
 
00:36:27.797 --> 00:36:29.916
four to me is a stable number.
 
00:36:30.077 --> 00:36:31.958
It's, you know, a table has four legs.
 
00:36:32.097 --> 00:36:32.277
It's,
 
00:36:32.577 --> 00:36:33.858
this secure structure that
 
00:36:33.898 --> 00:36:34.697
we were looking to build
 
00:36:34.717 --> 00:36:35.679
because there was so much
 
00:36:36.619 --> 00:36:37.659
over COVID and every
 
00:36:37.778 --> 00:36:39.278
organization in the world
 
00:36:39.579 --> 00:36:41.139
has the stability was taken out.
 
00:36:41.260 --> 00:36:41.460
You know,
 
00:36:41.500 --> 00:36:43.019
the carpet was swept out from
 
00:36:43.039 --> 00:36:43.719
underneath people.
 
00:36:43.800 --> 00:36:47.001
So that was the theme from the Tarot.
 
00:36:47.300 --> 00:36:48.981
And we would laugh every time I do a Tarot,
 
00:36:49.001 --> 00:36:49.661
just a card pool.
 
00:36:49.721 --> 00:36:51.121
Oh, there's the emperor again,
 
00:36:51.320 --> 00:36:53.141
card number four, you know?
 
00:36:53.342 --> 00:36:54.902
And so it was,
 
00:36:55.302 --> 00:36:56.282
it was beautiful when I
 
00:36:56.322 --> 00:36:57.541
started to see other things
 
00:36:57.581 --> 00:36:58.983
start to change in that
 
00:36:59.023 --> 00:37:00.083
pattern for myself.
 
00:37:01.123 --> 00:37:02.023
and that the force started
 
00:37:02.043 --> 00:37:03.443
to subside and say, you know,
 
00:37:03.543 --> 00:37:05.525
it feels everything's been
 
00:37:05.565 --> 00:37:06.626
anchored and structured now.
 
00:37:06.726 --> 00:37:08.447
So yeah, yeah.
 
00:37:08.467 --> 00:37:09.606
So that was just my sharing.
 
00:37:09.967 --> 00:37:11.047
I don't know if you have any
 
00:37:11.088 --> 00:37:12.108
stories or things you'd
 
00:37:12.128 --> 00:37:13.088
like to share as far as the
 
00:37:13.128 --> 00:37:15.030
Tarot and examples at all.
 
00:37:15.050 --> 00:37:16.271
I just wanted to share that one.
 
00:37:17.471 --> 00:37:17.590
Well,
 
00:37:17.630 --> 00:37:19.831
just to refine what you just said was,
 
00:37:20.012 --> 00:37:22.373
you know,
 
00:37:22.393 --> 00:37:25.255
the emperor of self and other leadership.
 
00:37:25.847 --> 00:37:28.110
It's like inner leadership
 
00:37:28.150 --> 00:37:29.351
versus outer leadership.
 
00:37:29.391 --> 00:37:31.233
And like that dichotomy of
 
00:37:31.293 --> 00:37:34.014
understanding foundation
 
00:37:34.275 --> 00:37:35.956
requires self-knowledge.
 
00:37:36.077 --> 00:37:37.998
It requires us to have our
 
00:37:38.018 --> 00:37:38.818
feet on the floor,
 
00:37:40.019 --> 00:37:41.320
but it also requires us to
 
00:37:41.340 --> 00:37:42.661
be in the community about
 
00:37:42.842 --> 00:37:43.722
what that means.
 
00:37:44.244 --> 00:37:47.746
And so to give a stable leader,
 
00:37:48.226 --> 00:37:50.708
like to create stable leadership,
 
00:37:50.748 --> 00:37:52.871
like in what you've done post-burnout,
 
00:37:52.911 --> 00:37:54.012
like that's fantastic.
 
00:37:54.621 --> 00:37:54.822
You know,
 
00:37:54.842 --> 00:37:56.623
if the if the tarot is like
 
00:37:57.184 --> 00:38:00.766
somewhere else and saying all the fives,
 
00:38:00.806 --> 00:38:02.989
for instance, or all the sevens or,
 
00:38:03.329 --> 00:38:03.588
you know,
 
00:38:03.628 --> 00:38:05.490
like it just would be another a
 
00:38:05.530 --> 00:38:07.391
different type of energy that it would be,
 
00:38:07.751 --> 00:38:09.853
you know, reflecting back.
 
00:38:10.563 --> 00:38:14.824
maybe chaos or maybe, uh, uncertainty or,
 
00:38:15.744 --> 00:38:18.005
um, whether or not a fight is worth it.
 
00:38:18.126 --> 00:38:18.465
Yes.
 
00:38:18.525 --> 00:38:21.085
Whereas something like that really was,
 
00:38:21.407 --> 00:38:24.927
I imagine quite, um, grounding and, um,
 
00:38:24.947 --> 00:38:25.728
reassuring.
 
00:38:25.748 --> 00:38:25.947
Yeah.
 
00:38:25.987 --> 00:38:28.188
Which is, which is so beautiful.
 
00:38:28.228 --> 00:38:30.088
And that's, that's how I would work,
 
00:38:30.929 --> 00:38:31.409
you know,
 
00:38:31.530 --> 00:38:32.889
regardless if it's therapy or
 
00:38:32.909 --> 00:38:34.311
spiritual direction with someone with,
 
00:38:34.871 --> 00:38:37.672
with, um, with tarot, it's really,
 
00:38:38.668 --> 00:38:42.251
about what it means for you.
 
00:38:42.351 --> 00:38:45.335
What do you see?
 
00:38:45.934 --> 00:38:47.577
If someone's pulling a card,
 
00:38:48.456 --> 00:38:49.597
often they have their own cards.
 
00:38:49.679 --> 00:38:51.800
I initiate, do you want to pull a card?
 
00:38:51.820 --> 00:38:52.101
Sure.
 
00:38:52.141 --> 00:38:52.460
Okay.
 
00:38:52.501 --> 00:38:54.382
So then we riff back and forth.
 
00:38:55.563 --> 00:38:56.744
Similar to dream work.
 
00:38:56.824 --> 00:38:58.166
What could that mean for you
 
00:38:58.206 --> 00:38:59.007
and your story?
 
00:38:59.086 --> 00:39:00.208
How does this fit in?
 
00:39:02.213 --> 00:39:04.175
And what's cool about the tarot,
 
00:39:04.614 --> 00:39:06.936
for those of you who are unfamiliar,
 
00:39:07.317 --> 00:39:10.280
it tells a story from zero or one to,
 
00:39:10.840 --> 00:39:13.242
well, zero for the major arcana, zero,
 
00:39:14.862 --> 00:39:15.983
you know, all the way up.
 
00:39:16.043 --> 00:39:18.065
So there's an arc to the
 
00:39:18.126 --> 00:39:20.967
story and similar to, you know,
 
00:39:21.027 --> 00:39:22.048
the minor arcana too.
 
00:39:22.108 --> 00:39:23.269
There's already an arc of
 
00:39:23.329 --> 00:39:25.431
storytelling that you can
 
00:39:25.492 --> 00:39:27.414
insert yourself into the
 
00:39:27.454 --> 00:39:29.135
story of the tarot as to like,
 
00:39:29.650 --> 00:39:31.592
Oh, where am I at on my journey?
 
00:39:31.632 --> 00:39:33.273
How can I reflect back what
 
00:39:33.293 --> 00:39:34.295
this means for me?
 
00:39:34.655 --> 00:39:35.916
And what is this for me and
 
00:39:35.958 --> 00:39:39.942
my wholeness reflected to me?
 
00:39:39.961 --> 00:39:42.925
So it's really a projective tool, you know,
 
00:39:43.025 --> 00:39:45.869
for active imagination, you know,
 
00:39:46.190 --> 00:39:48.813
to use a Jungian word or term.
 
00:39:49.673 --> 00:39:51.255
really an active imagination
 
00:39:51.315 --> 00:39:53.036
it's active it's it's
 
00:39:53.117 --> 00:39:54.318
processing it's really
 
00:39:54.338 --> 00:39:56.320
about it's not about
 
00:39:56.440 --> 00:39:59.684
reading the future or
 
00:39:59.724 --> 00:40:02.266
certainly not about me as a
 
00:40:02.326 --> 00:40:07.050
provider to project my stuff um it's more
 
00:40:07.650 --> 00:40:07.851
you know,
 
00:40:08.050 --> 00:40:10.112
what can we learn from your
 
00:40:10.152 --> 00:40:11.512
projections onto the image
 
00:40:11.532 --> 00:40:12.614
or your projections on your?
 
00:40:12.634 --> 00:40:14.914
Yeah, I'm glad you clarified that too.
 
00:40:14.934 --> 00:40:15.996
Because if someone is
 
00:40:16.076 --> 00:40:18.496
working through feelings of powerlessness,
 
00:40:18.536 --> 00:40:19.177
or feeling like you're
 
00:40:19.237 --> 00:40:20.898
trying to find that sense of security,
 
00:40:20.918 --> 00:40:22.019
that sense of safety to
 
00:40:22.099 --> 00:40:24.340
resource themselves, as you said before,
 
00:40:24.920 --> 00:40:26.461
I think that with people,
 
00:40:26.742 --> 00:40:27.422
that's why I love that
 
00:40:27.443 --> 00:40:27.983
you're doing this and
 
00:40:28.103 --> 00:40:29.583
integrating these types of tools.
 
00:40:29.943 --> 00:40:31.804
Because a lot of times as practitioners,
 
00:40:31.905 --> 00:40:33.025
as a reader myself,
 
00:40:33.206 --> 00:40:35.467
and even our readers at Firefly, you know,
 
00:40:35.547 --> 00:40:36.168
we have
 
00:40:36.407 --> 00:40:36.989
uh,
 
00:40:37.009 --> 00:40:38.809
training now to be trauma informed and
 
00:40:38.829 --> 00:40:41.612
make sure that we can in a graceful way,
 
00:40:41.692 --> 00:40:43.353
refer people if we need to,
 
00:40:43.673 --> 00:40:44.835
because if someone's going
 
00:40:44.855 --> 00:40:46.737
through a lot of uncertainty,
 
00:40:47.097 --> 00:40:48.657
there is this desire to
 
00:40:48.697 --> 00:40:49.619
want to know the future,
 
00:40:49.798 --> 00:40:50.619
what's going to happen.
 
00:40:50.659 --> 00:40:51.820
And we're not fortune tellers.
 
00:40:51.860 --> 00:40:52.521
We don't do that.
 
00:40:52.561 --> 00:40:53.782
We are very specific.
 
00:40:53.822 --> 00:40:54.422
And even Pat,
 
00:40:54.483 --> 00:40:55.764
our reader talks about that
 
00:40:55.784 --> 00:40:56.684
and even teaches that in
 
00:40:56.724 --> 00:40:58.025
her courses for Tarot.
 
00:40:58.525 --> 00:41:00.307
But I think too often that
 
00:41:00.347 --> 00:41:01.728
has been a tool that's been
 
00:41:01.909 --> 00:41:04.150
used in a space that, um,
 
00:41:04.891 --> 00:41:06.931
Absolutely, there is predictive astrology,
 
00:41:06.952 --> 00:41:08.271
there's predictive tarot,
 
00:41:08.311 --> 00:41:09.711
there's predictive arts.
 
00:41:10.172 --> 00:41:12.552
But at the same time, as a reader myself,
 
00:41:12.592 --> 00:41:13.833
they're always just
 
00:41:13.913 --> 00:41:16.893
reflections of what the current space is.
 
00:41:17.833 --> 00:41:18.893
Where you're at now,
 
00:41:18.994 --> 00:41:20.494
if you're continuing your trajectory,
 
00:41:20.554 --> 00:41:22.175
this is the probable outcome.
 
00:41:22.315 --> 00:41:23.936
If you shift who you are, where you're at,
 
00:41:23.976 --> 00:41:24.856
where your mindset is.
 
00:41:25.356 --> 00:41:27.677
then that completely different card pool,
 
00:41:27.697 --> 00:41:29.079
completely different projection.
 
00:41:29.358 --> 00:41:30.159
But I think it's really
 
00:41:30.179 --> 00:41:31.280
important if you're working
 
00:41:31.300 --> 00:41:31.860
with these tools,
 
00:41:31.880 --> 00:41:32.782
even for the first time and
 
00:41:32.802 --> 00:41:34.563
you know yourself to be like, well,
 
00:41:34.583 --> 00:41:36.364
what if I might want to
 
00:41:36.385 --> 00:41:37.164
just have some sort of
 
00:41:37.204 --> 00:41:38.025
sense of certainty that
 
00:41:38.045 --> 00:41:38.927
it's going to be this way,
 
00:41:39.146 --> 00:41:40.228
that Ali's saying that
 
00:41:40.248 --> 00:41:41.809
she's using it in a
 
00:41:41.849 --> 00:41:43.670
specifically reflective
 
00:41:43.710 --> 00:41:44.831
tool for getting deeper
 
00:41:44.911 --> 00:41:46.413
into the answers within yourself.
 
00:41:46.733 --> 00:41:48.273
And I think my opinion is
 
00:41:48.313 --> 00:41:49.434
that's what these art forms
 
00:41:49.474 --> 00:41:50.556
are to do anyway.
 
00:41:51.056 --> 00:41:53.538
that all of these tools holistically,
 
00:41:53.557 --> 00:41:54.657
if you integrate them all together,
 
00:41:54.717 --> 00:41:55.739
everything we've talked about in the show,
 
00:41:55.778 --> 00:41:56.159
everything again,
 
00:41:56.579 --> 00:41:57.199
all of it is about
 
00:41:57.300 --> 00:41:57.780
expanding your
 
00:41:57.820 --> 00:41:59.701
consciousness and that self-awareness,
 
00:41:59.721 --> 00:42:00.320
because that's where you
 
00:42:00.360 --> 00:42:01.242
find that sense of,
 
00:42:01.621 --> 00:42:03.463
that's where power is anyway,
 
00:42:03.963 --> 00:42:04.983
if you're seeking that
 
00:42:05.523 --> 00:42:07.646
sense of self-assuredness
 
00:42:07.686 --> 00:42:08.545
and who you are and your
 
00:42:08.585 --> 00:42:09.407
path and journey.
 
00:42:10.206 --> 00:42:11.068
But astrology,
 
00:42:11.327 --> 00:42:12.568
is there anything as far as
 
00:42:12.668 --> 00:42:14.009
an example or practical
 
00:42:14.028 --> 00:42:15.889
application as far as how
 
00:42:15.929 --> 00:42:16.911
you've used that?
 
00:42:16.931 --> 00:42:18.411
We could also share that one too.
 
00:42:21.704 --> 00:42:21.864
Oh,
 
00:42:21.884 --> 00:42:24.407
I love working needle astrology with
 
00:42:24.746 --> 00:42:25.027
folks.
 
00:42:25.427 --> 00:42:26.268
I do a lot.
 
00:42:26.309 --> 00:42:27.670
So as a spiritual director,
 
00:42:27.771 --> 00:42:28.630
now as a therapist,
 
00:42:28.670 --> 00:42:34.637
so I often work with folks
 
00:42:34.918 --> 00:42:36.699
on their needle charts with them.
 
00:42:38.155 --> 00:42:40.635
If they are open to it as a tool, again,
 
00:42:40.675 --> 00:42:42.217
for self-reflection as to
 
00:42:42.257 --> 00:42:43.157
where their spiritual
 
00:42:44.217 --> 00:42:46.438
journey is and where they're kind of at,
 
00:42:46.458 --> 00:42:47.438
where their feet are at,
 
00:42:47.498 --> 00:42:48.798
where they feel invited to
 
00:42:48.898 --> 00:42:49.978
and possibly even work
 
00:42:49.998 --> 00:42:51.199
transits as to what's
 
00:42:51.400 --> 00:42:53.280
potentially energetically happening.
 
00:42:53.740 --> 00:42:56.061
So folks really enjoy that as well.
 
00:42:57.262 --> 00:42:58.364
I don't know just a fun
 
00:42:58.403 --> 00:42:59.364
expansive way of
 
00:42:59.405 --> 00:43:01.168
understanding the cosmos
 
00:43:01.447 --> 00:43:03.150
right and how we are just
 
00:43:03.391 --> 00:43:06.034
pieces of it in energetic
 
00:43:06.074 --> 00:43:08.018
ways and it's just it's
 
00:43:08.038 --> 00:43:09.300
just a great way of doing
 
00:43:10.101 --> 00:43:12.023
uh spiritual care um
 
00:43:13.184 --> 00:43:15.666
And, you know, I, I can orient, you know,
 
00:43:15.686 --> 00:43:19.168
similar to tarot, similar to dream work,
 
00:43:19.789 --> 00:43:22.369
um, to use in therapy,
 
00:43:22.911 --> 00:43:25.771
astrology concepts as archetypal,
 
00:43:26.333 --> 00:43:29.914
as sort of the union idea of, um,
 
00:43:29.954 --> 00:43:30.894
reflections of the
 
00:43:30.954 --> 00:43:32.195
unconscious that are
 
00:43:32.255 --> 00:43:34.177
embodied in our experience.
 
00:43:34.597 --> 00:43:35.677
So, um,
 
00:43:36.338 --> 00:43:38.119
I'm really sensitive to using
 
00:43:38.179 --> 00:43:40.481
whether or not I'm not a astrologer,
 
00:43:40.501 --> 00:43:42.541
I wouldn't term myself as that.
 
00:43:42.914 --> 00:43:44.056
So I don't necessarily use
 
00:43:44.097 --> 00:43:45.398
them in therapy in the way
 
00:43:45.418 --> 00:43:48.081
that it would be like what
 
00:43:48.222 --> 00:43:49.864
a traditional model of
 
00:43:50.063 --> 00:43:51.005
astrology would be.
 
00:43:51.445 --> 00:43:51.987
But rather,
 
00:43:52.887 --> 00:43:54.610
if it's already a language that
 
00:43:54.650 --> 00:43:56.072
that person is using,
 
00:43:56.452 --> 00:43:58.494
then I'm able to use that language back.
 
00:43:59.072 --> 00:44:01.454
And so that's partly actually why,
 
00:44:01.894 --> 00:44:03.175
actually that's fully why I
 
00:44:03.217 --> 00:44:04.356
started studying astrology
 
00:44:04.376 --> 00:44:05.998
is because I started
 
00:44:06.039 --> 00:44:08.141
working in soul care.
 
00:44:08.661 --> 00:44:10.262
I opened my own practice as
 
00:44:10.282 --> 00:44:13.864
a spiritual director and people,
 
00:44:14.045 --> 00:44:15.385
I started seeing folks who
 
00:44:15.467 --> 00:44:16.807
had the language of
 
00:44:16.847 --> 00:44:20.230
astrology were talking about moon phases,
 
00:44:20.451 --> 00:44:21.771
or were even talking about
 
00:44:22.472 --> 00:44:24.074
Venus wisdom or whatever it was.
 
00:44:24.114 --> 00:44:24.554
And I was like,
 
00:44:25.315 --> 00:44:26.155
I need to know what they're
 
00:44:26.175 --> 00:44:26.715
talking about.
 
00:44:28.059 --> 00:44:29.019
Less so for me,
 
00:44:29.059 --> 00:44:30.400
but rather like I just want
 
00:44:30.420 --> 00:44:31.681
to meet them where they're at.
 
00:44:31.961 --> 00:44:33.163
And so since then,
 
00:44:33.322 --> 00:44:35.384
I've just I've loved that
 
00:44:35.463 --> 00:44:36.385
this as a just a
 
00:44:36.505 --> 00:44:41.467
collaborative effort of introspection.
 
00:44:41.827 --> 00:44:44.210
But the biggest thing that I
 
00:44:44.250 --> 00:44:47.012
get out of that I see
 
00:44:47.052 --> 00:44:48.452
clients get out of
 
00:44:48.512 --> 00:44:50.293
astrology work is self-compassion.
 
00:44:50.373 --> 00:44:50.574
Yeah.
 
00:44:51.094 --> 00:44:53.735
It's such a beautiful tool
 
00:44:53.835 --> 00:44:55.797
to use for understanding
 
00:44:56.418 --> 00:44:58.639
that what's without is
 
00:44:58.679 --> 00:45:00.960
within and what's within is without,
 
00:45:01.199 --> 00:45:02.219
that we are never not
 
00:45:02.239 --> 00:45:05.362
connected and that we can
 
00:45:05.481 --> 00:45:07.702
orient ourselves to that
 
00:45:08.695 --> 00:45:10.735
grounded understanding of
 
00:45:10.815 --> 00:45:13.257
soul as part and parcel of
 
00:45:13.317 --> 00:45:14.057
something bigger.
 
00:45:14.677 --> 00:45:16.338
And what that is obviously
 
00:45:16.358 --> 00:45:18.320
is as independent as each person.
 
00:45:18.380 --> 00:45:21.081
Every person gets to define what that is.
 
00:45:21.121 --> 00:45:22.382
It's trauma-informed care.
 
00:45:22.481 --> 00:45:24.023
You get to decide what that is.
 
00:45:24.682 --> 00:45:26.043
But that is what's taken
 
00:45:26.083 --> 00:45:30.005
away when we are traumatized is agency,
 
00:45:30.085 --> 00:45:32.286
autonomy, understanding we're connected.
 
00:45:32.666 --> 00:45:33.648
That's what's taken away.
 
00:45:34.420 --> 00:45:35.981
So part of these tools is
 
00:45:36.041 --> 00:45:38.742
really to reclaim that we
 
00:45:38.762 --> 00:45:40.143
are part and parcel of this
 
00:45:40.184 --> 00:45:40.965
bigger picture.
 
00:45:41.565 --> 00:45:42.786
What does that mean for you?
 
00:45:43.186 --> 00:45:45.148
How can we continue to develop that?
 
00:45:45.728 --> 00:45:48.010
And not a spiritual bypassing way,
 
00:45:48.050 --> 00:45:49.070
but a rooting way.
 
00:45:50.780 --> 00:45:52.601
I love the aspect of
 
00:45:52.641 --> 00:45:54.541
understanding the language of astrology.
 
00:45:54.702 --> 00:45:55.101
Obviously,
 
00:45:55.161 --> 00:45:57.163
I get readings for my business
 
00:45:57.242 --> 00:45:58.123
on a yearly basis,
 
00:45:58.164 --> 00:46:00.123
but when I dived into it,
 
00:46:00.405 --> 00:46:01.744
Fourteen was my first book,
 
00:46:01.784 --> 00:46:02.905
and then I was hooked.
 
00:46:03.965 --> 00:46:05.186
When I first met another
 
00:46:05.226 --> 00:46:07.047
person that could speak that language,
 
00:46:07.987 --> 00:46:10.389
It was just like diving in like a big nerd,
 
00:46:10.548 --> 00:46:11.309
like we're going to go and
 
00:46:11.369 --> 00:46:13.449
talk about our space and
 
00:46:13.530 --> 00:46:16.110
our Venus and our Mars,
 
00:46:16.130 --> 00:46:17.311
how we communicate, our Mercury.
 
00:46:17.871 --> 00:46:20.311
And I just felt like this
 
00:46:20.391 --> 00:46:21.913
language is so full,
 
00:46:22.152 --> 00:46:23.733
especially if you are into
 
00:46:23.952 --> 00:46:26.173
the psyche or the soul or how that works.
 
00:46:27.114 --> 00:46:28.795
And I think for an example,
 
00:46:28.835 --> 00:46:29.815
for my own journey,
 
00:46:30.215 --> 00:46:32.016
having multiple astrologers
 
00:46:32.036 --> 00:46:32.735
that I work around,
 
00:46:32.755 --> 00:46:34.376
that they are astrologers that I could
 
00:46:35.016 --> 00:46:36.599
look at my own transits and
 
00:46:36.619 --> 00:46:37.940
look at things happening and say,
 
00:46:38.280 --> 00:46:38.440
you know,
 
00:46:38.460 --> 00:46:40.001
I've been noticing this and I'm
 
00:46:40.081 --> 00:46:41.342
feeling this and this is
 
00:46:41.362 --> 00:46:42.344
what's happening with my planet.
 
00:46:42.364 --> 00:46:43.724
It's like, oh, that makes so much sense.
 
00:46:43.744 --> 00:46:45.387
And I'm like, isn't that interesting?
 
00:46:45.827 --> 00:46:47.949
And it gives me not only
 
00:46:48.048 --> 00:46:50.190
awareness to have more
 
00:46:50.291 --> 00:46:53.114
self-awareness around a potential event,
 
00:46:54.275 --> 00:46:55.034
circumstance,
 
00:46:55.054 --> 00:46:56.876
a life change or shift or
 
00:46:56.916 --> 00:46:59.277
transition or opportunity, right?
 
00:46:59.458 --> 00:47:00.518
There's an opportunity here.
 
00:47:01.278 --> 00:47:02.739
I think that that awareness
 
00:47:02.900 --> 00:47:04.280
of the language and what it
 
00:47:04.300 --> 00:47:05.460
looks like and my own
 
00:47:05.581 --> 00:47:07.402
self-knowledge and awareness of who I am,
 
00:47:07.422 --> 00:47:08.061
where I'm at,
 
00:47:08.722 --> 00:47:10.844
it gives me more bandwidth
 
00:47:10.903 --> 00:47:12.465
to see how it could show up
 
00:47:12.864 --> 00:47:14.806
realistically and then go,
 
00:47:14.885 --> 00:47:16.367
that's what it looks like right now.
 
00:47:16.827 --> 00:47:17.889
That's what it looks like.
 
00:47:18.409 --> 00:47:21.072
And I like the ability to have that.
 
00:47:22.072 --> 00:47:23.474
I am an Aries, so I like challenge.
 
00:47:24.436 --> 00:47:26.038
Challenge is my motivation.
 
00:47:26.077 --> 00:47:26.737
So if you know what your
 
00:47:26.777 --> 00:47:27.759
motivation is or you know
 
00:47:27.780 --> 00:47:28.420
what your client's
 
00:47:28.460 --> 00:47:29.862
motivations are by watching,
 
00:47:30.181 --> 00:47:32.103
looking at their natal chart, you know,
 
00:47:32.164 --> 00:47:34.045
like that's powerful
 
00:47:34.067 --> 00:47:36.449
because then you can support them in,
 
00:47:36.469 --> 00:47:36.728
you know,
 
00:47:37.409 --> 00:47:38.351
what drives them?
 
00:47:38.411 --> 00:47:39.713
What, what is the thing that can,
 
00:47:39.893 --> 00:47:40.514
they can look at their
 
00:47:40.554 --> 00:47:41.615
transits or look at these
 
00:47:41.976 --> 00:47:43.918
archetypal symbols that are
 
00:47:43.958 --> 00:47:44.780
happening in their life or
 
00:47:44.800 --> 00:47:45.800
that's their birth chart.
 
00:47:45.820 --> 00:47:46.461
So they can understand
 
00:47:46.501 --> 00:47:48.724
themselves and feel that sense of that.
 
00:47:48.744 --> 00:47:51.347
You said sense of purpose and sense of,
 
00:47:51.588 --> 00:47:51.668
um,
 
00:47:54.293 --> 00:47:57.615
I like the word acceptance
 
00:47:57.715 --> 00:47:58.976
of the self because when
 
00:47:58.996 --> 00:48:02.000
you can see yourself from this, wow,
 
00:48:02.119 --> 00:48:02.800
this is affirming.
 
00:48:02.820 --> 00:48:03.702
This is who I am.
 
00:48:04.121 --> 00:48:05.023
I made this way and there's
 
00:48:05.043 --> 00:48:06.123
nothing wrong with it.
 
00:48:06.463 --> 00:48:07.125
This gives me the
 
00:48:07.164 --> 00:48:08.385
opportunity in this area to
 
00:48:08.405 --> 00:48:09.327
be skillful with it and
 
00:48:09.347 --> 00:48:10.788
this area to not be skillful with it.
 
00:48:11.585 --> 00:48:12.905
And I went through a transit
 
00:48:12.945 --> 00:48:14.067
Pluto moon conjunction,
 
00:48:14.106 --> 00:48:15.088
which is one that's very
 
00:48:15.447 --> 00:48:17.369
uncommon to happen in people's lifetimes.
 
00:48:17.730 --> 00:48:18.911
And during that transit,
 
00:48:19.190 --> 00:48:20.311
guess what my astrologer said?
 
00:48:20.911 --> 00:48:21.672
You need to go see your
 
00:48:21.713 --> 00:48:22.552
counselor right now.
 
00:48:22.873 --> 00:48:24.695
You need to go even more so
 
00:48:24.894 --> 00:48:26.135
because the moon sign is
 
00:48:26.155 --> 00:48:27.237
your unconscious.
 
00:48:27.657 --> 00:48:29.217
It's the depth of your intuition,
 
00:48:29.257 --> 00:48:30.478
these unseen things.
 
00:48:30.659 --> 00:48:32.800
And Pluto, the planet of rebirth,
 
00:48:32.820 --> 00:48:33.481
destruction,
 
00:48:33.922 --> 00:48:36.003
transformation was going past
 
00:48:36.063 --> 00:48:37.224
this deep transition.
 
00:48:37.324 --> 00:48:38.545
part of myself that was my
 
00:48:38.585 --> 00:48:39.666
inner childhood wounds
 
00:48:39.706 --> 00:48:40.606
things that I'm like I've
 
00:48:40.626 --> 00:48:41.806
done a lot of work in years
 
00:48:41.847 --> 00:48:43.088
and I thought when that
 
00:48:43.128 --> 00:48:44.568
came up I was like well I
 
00:48:44.829 --> 00:48:45.610
I've already done it I
 
00:48:45.670 --> 00:48:46.610
continue to do work and I
 
00:48:46.650 --> 00:48:47.771
was like when it started
 
00:48:47.811 --> 00:48:49.512
hitting I was like oh yeah
 
00:48:49.532 --> 00:48:52.675
she's right yeah oh wow and
 
00:48:52.735 --> 00:48:53.655
it's so cool to have the
 
00:48:53.695 --> 00:48:55.137
awareness like this is a
 
00:48:55.197 --> 00:48:56.338
transit this is something
 
00:48:56.358 --> 00:48:58.139
that's like symbolically
 
00:48:58.418 --> 00:48:59.500
already here it says in the
 
00:48:59.539 --> 00:49:00.601
stars and that made me feel
 
00:49:01.240 --> 00:49:03.163
supported by a higher power
 
00:49:03.202 --> 00:49:04.242
it made me feel supported
 
00:49:04.302 --> 00:49:05.824
that this is an opportunity
 
00:49:05.844 --> 00:49:07.445
to transform and I had the
 
00:49:07.485 --> 00:49:08.246
self-awareness to do it
 
00:49:08.266 --> 00:49:09.927
with help and it and it's
 
00:49:09.967 --> 00:49:11.027
lasting for this immediate
 
00:49:11.068 --> 00:49:12.329
period of time which was
 
00:49:12.389 --> 00:49:14.331
really cool for me too that
 
00:49:14.471 --> 00:49:15.431
because you always think
 
00:49:15.472 --> 00:49:16.112
it's not going to end
 
00:49:16.132 --> 00:49:17.253
you're like yeah this too
 
00:49:17.273 --> 00:49:19.434
shall pass so I I feel like
 
00:49:19.474 --> 00:49:21.436
that really really changed
 
00:49:21.496 --> 00:49:23.637
my my journey especially it
 
00:49:23.657 --> 00:49:24.518
was at the peak of my
 
00:49:24.539 --> 00:49:28.061
burnout so thank god for astrology
 
00:49:31.521 --> 00:49:31.842
Yeah,
 
00:49:31.862 --> 00:49:33.445
and I love that you said about just
 
00:49:33.485 --> 00:49:34.527
self-acceptance,
 
00:49:34.586 --> 00:49:36.871
but also understanding just
 
00:49:36.931 --> 00:49:41.199
a wider viewpoint on what these...
 
00:49:42.320 --> 00:49:44.001
The word that came to mind is invitation.
 
00:49:44.201 --> 00:49:48.083
Like, how am I invited into this concept?
 
00:49:48.264 --> 00:49:48.643
You know,
 
00:49:48.664 --> 00:49:50.164
and that's really what creative
 
00:49:50.184 --> 00:49:51.585
practice is always about.
 
00:49:51.686 --> 00:49:53.847
Like, how am I invited in?
 
00:49:54.288 --> 00:49:55.449
Not someone else telling me
 
00:49:55.489 --> 00:49:58.871
what to do or someone else directing me,
 
00:49:59.291 --> 00:50:01.632
but rather like with my own agency,
 
00:50:01.713 --> 00:50:03.092
with connecting to my own
 
00:50:03.172 --> 00:50:06.094
inner wisdom that's been so
 
00:50:06.114 --> 00:50:07.516
just railroaded.
 
00:50:09.422 --> 00:50:11.606
by my caregiving role,
 
00:50:11.666 --> 00:50:14.210
by my multiple roles, by my burnout,
 
00:50:14.271 --> 00:50:15.492
by so much.
 
00:50:16.226 --> 00:50:17.447
how can I orient myself to
 
00:50:17.507 --> 00:50:18.588
what I feel invited to do?
 
00:50:18.608 --> 00:50:21.831
And yeah, it can be really fruitful.
 
00:50:21.990 --> 00:50:23.672
Yeah, I love that key component.
 
00:50:24.932 --> 00:50:26.474
And so for listeners who
 
00:50:26.693 --> 00:50:28.416
maybe are like really
 
00:50:28.456 --> 00:50:29.597
resonating with this,
 
00:50:29.677 --> 00:50:30.918
they are really curious
 
00:50:30.978 --> 00:50:32.318
about maybe retreat
 
00:50:32.338 --> 00:50:33.460
intensives or maybe just
 
00:50:33.500 --> 00:50:34.960
doing some union dream work
 
00:50:35.161 --> 00:50:36.922
with you or any other of
 
00:50:36.963 --> 00:50:38.043
the services you're offering.
 
00:50:39.264 --> 00:50:39.965
Could you tell us a little
 
00:50:39.985 --> 00:50:42.927
bit more about that process
 
00:50:42.967 --> 00:50:43.867
and what it looks like to
 
00:50:43.947 --> 00:50:44.648
get in touch with you?
 
00:50:46.166 --> 00:50:51.690
Yeah, well, so I have free consultations.
 
00:50:51.750 --> 00:50:52.710
You just go on my website,
 
00:50:52.750 --> 00:50:54.010
rootgrowthrive.com and
 
00:50:54.150 --> 00:50:55.431
click free consultation.
 
00:50:55.452 --> 00:50:56.512
You can schedule right away.
 
00:50:57.873 --> 00:51:00.675
For therapy, I see folks in Pennsylvania.
 
00:51:01.155 --> 00:51:02.576
I'm also an out-of-state
 
00:51:02.635 --> 00:51:04.277
provider from Florida as well,
 
00:51:04.396 --> 00:51:07.038
but I see folks online for therapy.
 
00:51:08.619 --> 00:51:10.039
And we can assess in that
 
00:51:10.079 --> 00:51:12.141
twenty minute session, like what
 
00:51:13.360 --> 00:51:14.882
My services are best used
 
00:51:14.922 --> 00:51:17.001
for if I could be of service to you.
 
00:51:17.101 --> 00:51:20.702
If not, I have great referrals.
 
00:51:20.922 --> 00:51:26.744
I'm here for providing resources.
 
00:51:27.005 --> 00:51:28.824
So we can talk about like, oh, well,
 
00:51:28.965 --> 00:51:30.125
I may not be the best for you,
 
00:51:30.144 --> 00:51:31.525
but this person could be, etc.
 
00:51:33.347 --> 00:51:35.148
But yeah, that's basically it.
 
00:51:35.268 --> 00:51:35.507
I mean,
 
00:51:35.807 --> 00:51:38.148
if you are someone who's curious
 
00:51:38.208 --> 00:51:39.369
about retreat intensives,
 
00:51:39.449 --> 00:51:41.650
I have a special thirty
 
00:51:41.690 --> 00:51:45.072
minute retreat intensive
 
00:51:45.873 --> 00:51:48.135
consult on my on my
 
00:51:48.175 --> 00:51:50.295
Calendly links in my bio.
 
00:51:50.356 --> 00:51:51.016
We can link that.
 
00:51:51.436 --> 00:51:53.579
But we can and then we talk
 
00:51:53.619 --> 00:51:56.061
about like if you have an intention,
 
00:51:56.121 --> 00:51:57.021
if you have something you
 
00:51:57.061 --> 00:51:58.603
want to quote unquote get over,
 
00:51:58.724 --> 00:52:00.065
I have this thing like I
 
00:52:00.085 --> 00:52:03.288
have this or that or, you know,
 
00:52:03.447 --> 00:52:06.269
or just feel off or didn't
 
00:52:06.630 --> 00:52:07.931
even need intention.
 
00:52:07.972 --> 00:52:09.152
But usually folks who come
 
00:52:09.233 --> 00:52:10.454
into intensives are like
 
00:52:10.594 --> 00:52:11.715
they have something that's
 
00:52:11.755 --> 00:52:14.438
been picking at them that they're like,
 
00:52:14.518 --> 00:52:15.818
I'm ready to just let this
 
00:52:15.858 --> 00:52:17.581
go or move past.
 
00:52:18.601 --> 00:52:19.121
Some people,
 
00:52:19.942 --> 00:52:21.282
actually about fifty percent
 
00:52:21.302 --> 00:52:22.583
of folks that I see for
 
00:52:22.623 --> 00:52:23.905
retreat intensives or
 
00:52:24.445 --> 00:52:25.626
therapeutic intensives,
 
00:52:25.646 --> 00:52:27.407
I'll have their own therapist.
 
00:52:27.847 --> 00:52:29.248
So we get we get to talk
 
00:52:29.268 --> 00:52:30.289
about whether or not I'd be
 
00:52:30.329 --> 00:52:31.409
in collaboration with their
 
00:52:31.449 --> 00:52:32.710
current therapist or not
 
00:52:32.931 --> 00:52:33.911
and what that would look
 
00:52:33.931 --> 00:52:35.952
like for them to make sure
 
00:52:35.972 --> 00:52:36.992
that they feel like they're
 
00:52:37.032 --> 00:52:38.914
on boarded and then off boarded with me,
 
00:52:39.394 --> 00:52:40.815
you know, in a way that feels really.
 
00:52:42.534 --> 00:52:45.255
uh right for them so um so
 
00:52:45.275 --> 00:52:46.034
it's really easy to get in
 
00:52:46.074 --> 00:52:47.215
touch with me I mean I'm
 
00:52:47.695 --> 00:52:50.976
I'm an email away um and I
 
00:52:51.016 --> 00:52:52.536
do dream work and you know
 
00:52:52.577 --> 00:52:53.818
soul care you can read
 
00:52:53.838 --> 00:52:54.717
about all that on my
 
00:52:54.757 --> 00:52:56.358
website uh for people
 
00:52:56.378 --> 00:52:59.559
worldwide so um uh it's a
 
00:52:59.579 --> 00:53:02.639
non-therapy uh uh container
 
00:53:02.840 --> 00:53:04.440
but it's it's spiritual direction
 
00:53:05.119 --> 00:53:06.681
can read about all that online.
 
00:53:06.701 --> 00:53:07.601
Yeah.
 
00:53:07.641 --> 00:53:09.342
Well, before I go into my final question,
 
00:53:09.623 --> 00:53:10.885
do you have anything else
 
00:53:10.925 --> 00:53:12.465
about our topic today for
 
00:53:12.525 --> 00:53:13.447
the integrative approaches
 
00:53:13.487 --> 00:53:14.708
for recovery and the
 
00:53:14.728 --> 00:53:16.208
intensives that you want to
 
00:53:16.228 --> 00:53:17.070
talk about or share?
 
00:53:17.090 --> 00:53:19.731
Yeah, I don't know.
 
00:53:19.831 --> 00:53:20.952
I mean, I think in general,
 
00:53:21.032 --> 00:53:24.735
like people know when they're ready for,
 
00:53:25.635 --> 00:53:25.876
um,
 
00:53:27.545 --> 00:53:28.867
for lack of a better word healing.
 
00:53:29.126 --> 00:53:33.570
I mean, I think my, I was like,
 
00:53:33.590 --> 00:53:34.650
if you feeling sometimes
 
00:53:34.670 --> 00:53:36.813
about the word healing, um, because I,
 
00:53:37.072 --> 00:53:38.293
I have an orientation that
 
00:53:38.333 --> 00:53:40.596
we're all whole, but, um,
 
00:53:40.615 --> 00:53:42.016
but this whole idea of like,
 
00:53:42.137 --> 00:53:43.297
I think we're all know when
 
00:53:43.318 --> 00:53:45.259
we're ready to orient
 
00:53:45.298 --> 00:53:46.639
ourselves back to ourselves.
 
00:53:47.380 --> 00:53:50.342
And, um, we have that little whisper.
 
00:53:51.177 --> 00:53:52.898
that either something's not
 
00:53:52.958 --> 00:53:54.599
right or that now is the
 
00:53:54.639 --> 00:53:59.603
time or maybe just taking
 
00:53:59.722 --> 00:54:02.045
one tiny step to find the
 
00:54:02.085 --> 00:54:03.545
resource that's right for you.
 
00:54:03.565 --> 00:54:06.807
I think, I think listen to that,
 
00:54:06.847 --> 00:54:08.228
listen to that intuition.
 
00:54:08.349 --> 00:54:09.809
It's there for a reason and
 
00:54:09.829 --> 00:54:10.769
it's always been there.
 
00:54:10.869 --> 00:54:12.550
It's just, I would say,
 
00:54:12.610 --> 00:54:14.072
listen to your intuition.
 
00:54:14.172 --> 00:54:14.813
Yeah.
 
00:54:14.833 --> 00:54:15.213
Awesome.
 
00:54:16.074 --> 00:54:16.215
Well,
 
00:54:16.315 --> 00:54:17.916
the final question I really have is
 
00:54:18.277 --> 00:54:19.657
for listeners that maybe
 
00:54:19.677 --> 00:54:21.699
you're feeling overwhelmed or burned out.
 
00:54:22.300 --> 00:54:24.280
Are there any first steps
 
00:54:24.601 --> 00:54:26.422
that you always recommend
 
00:54:26.443 --> 00:54:27.724
to start their healing
 
00:54:27.744 --> 00:54:29.204
journey just to get started?
 
00:54:30.871 --> 00:54:31.411
Yeah, I mean,
 
00:54:32.211 --> 00:54:33.594
I think I just loop around to
 
00:54:33.614 --> 00:54:34.735
what we were saying in the beginning,
 
00:54:34.795 --> 00:54:36.677
assessing your safety and security.
 
00:54:36.916 --> 00:54:37.117
Like,
 
00:54:37.237 --> 00:54:40.699
where do you feel connected if you
 
00:54:40.739 --> 00:54:42.302
can identify where your
 
00:54:42.342 --> 00:54:44.483
resources are currently?
 
00:54:47.045 --> 00:54:48.668
If there's one person who
 
00:54:48.688 --> 00:54:49.768
can be your advocate,
 
00:54:49.889 --> 00:54:51.331
who can be there for you
 
00:54:51.371 --> 00:54:53.853
that would be on your side, who is that?
 
00:54:54.355 --> 00:54:58.577
And to use those resources,
 
00:54:59.159 --> 00:55:00.219
lean into them.
 
00:55:03.222 --> 00:55:04.782
And if you're finding a lot
 
00:55:04.822 --> 00:55:06.063
of red flags when you're
 
00:55:06.224 --> 00:55:08.045
sort of looking at your situation,
 
00:55:08.126 --> 00:55:10.288
to know that you're not alone.
 
00:55:10.307 --> 00:55:12.128
There's so many resources
 
00:55:12.268 --> 00:55:14.070
out there for all types of
 
00:55:14.090 --> 00:55:15.472
people in all walks of life.
 
00:55:18.672 --> 00:55:20.432
accessing them is just, it's,
 
00:55:20.452 --> 00:55:23.514
it's one step towards feeling better.
 
00:55:23.614 --> 00:55:25.335
So, um,
 
00:55:25.456 --> 00:55:27.175
oftentimes when people come to me
 
00:55:28.177 --> 00:55:30.197
for consults, oh,
 
00:55:30.297 --> 00:55:32.458
it's heartbreaking how long people wait.
 
00:55:33.039 --> 00:55:34.179
They just feel like they
 
00:55:34.239 --> 00:55:36.021
wait and they wait and wait.
 
00:55:36.101 --> 00:55:37.382
It's like years.
 
00:55:37.422 --> 00:55:38.021
And then there's something
 
00:55:38.061 --> 00:55:39.563
like researchers said like
 
00:55:39.603 --> 00:55:41.023
ten years till someone
 
00:55:41.704 --> 00:55:42.965
finally gets to therapy,
 
00:55:43.065 --> 00:55:43.864
something like that.
 
00:55:44.885 --> 00:55:45.465
Um, but
 
00:55:46.061 --> 00:55:47.942
regardless, it's just, you don't,
 
00:55:48.481 --> 00:55:49.762
no one deserves to suffer.
 
00:55:50.161 --> 00:55:52.362
So, and no one deserves to struggle alone.
 
00:55:52.463 --> 00:55:52.983
It's not,
 
00:55:53.222 --> 00:55:54.804
it's not what they were meant to do.
 
00:55:54.884 --> 00:55:58.585
So, um, yeah, yeah, that would,
 
00:55:58.625 --> 00:55:59.184
that's what I would say.
 
00:55:59.264 --> 00:55:59.704
Yeah.
 
00:55:59.744 --> 00:56:00.264
Thank you.
 
00:56:00.505 --> 00:56:02.806
I think that is absolutely perfect,
 
00:56:03.505 --> 00:56:04.626
but I hope you guys really
 
00:56:04.666 --> 00:56:05.586
liked this episode.
 
00:56:05.606 --> 00:56:07.748
I thank you so much for coming on again.
 
00:56:07.768 --> 00:56:09.748
I, I always want to talk longer with you.
 
00:56:09.788 --> 00:56:10.628
We have always so much so we
 
00:56:10.648 --> 00:56:11.469
could talk about, um,
 
00:56:12.081 --> 00:56:12.702
Yeah.
 
00:56:12.722 --> 00:56:14.842
But if you guys do have a specific topic,
 
00:56:15.362 --> 00:56:15.922
actually,
 
00:56:16.063 --> 00:56:17.764
that you want us to go and talk
 
00:56:17.884 --> 00:56:19.063
with Allie in at length,
 
00:56:19.123 --> 00:56:20.324
please let us know.
 
00:56:20.503 --> 00:56:21.525
Actually, please do.
 
00:56:21.545 --> 00:56:22.545
Because there's so much
 
00:56:22.565 --> 00:56:23.545
where we could even go into
 
00:56:23.724 --> 00:56:25.166
a whole episode on Jungian dream work,
 
00:56:25.226 --> 00:56:25.646
I'm sure.
 
00:56:26.545 --> 00:56:27.806
So yeah, for sure.
 
00:56:28.126 --> 00:56:29.827
But other than that, thanks for being here,
 
00:56:29.867 --> 00:56:30.527
Miss Allie.
 
00:56:30.786 --> 00:56:34.407
And we will see you guys later.
 
00:56:35.048 --> 00:56:36.588
Thank you guys for tuning in
 
00:56:36.789 --> 00:56:39.369
and be well till next time, my friends.
 
00:56:40.972 --> 00:56:42.373
thank you for listening to
 
00:56:42.414 --> 00:56:44.914
the mind body detox podcast
 
00:56:45.315 --> 00:56:46.896
if you love this podcast
 
00:56:47.175 --> 00:56:48.436
share it with others and
 
00:56:48.496 --> 00:56:50.097
leave us a review your
 
00:56:50.117 --> 00:56:51.597
reviews help us more than
 
00:56:51.637 --> 00:56:53.278
you know and supports us
 
00:56:53.338 --> 00:56:55.000
continuing to make episodes
 
00:56:55.340 --> 00:56:56.481
and being heard from all
 
00:56:56.541 --> 00:56:58.322
over the world you can also
 
00:56:58.382 --> 00:56:59.641
follow the link in our show
 
00:56:59.681 --> 00:57:00.862
notes to submit a topic
 
00:57:01.003 --> 00:57:02.403
that you would like to hear on the show